a new flame eater, just to be different

[madjackghengis]

Hi all, after seeing the success of so many "poppins", and playing around with ideas, I thought I'd build another to try out some new intersections of different engines.  This is basically a "poppin", but scaled up a bit, with a three quarter inch bore, an inch and a quarter stroke, cast iron piston in a cast iron cylinder, with a cast iron head.
I started with a stick of cast iron, about an inch and a quarter diameter, turning the cooling fins first so I could use the tailstock for support.
a new flame eater, just to be different

starting the cooling fins

a new flame eater, just to be different

fins completed, time to drill before boring.

a new flame eater, just to be different

After step drilling and then boring just undersized, I reamed it out with a .750 reamer

a new flame eater, just to be different

I want this to have good compression, so I'm going to lap it using a piece of delrin plastic to hold the compound, and have cut it to just barely fit in the bore as reamed.

a new flame eater, just to be different

after smearing the lap with some fine valve grinding compound, it is rolled on a steel table with a piece of steel to embed the compound in the plastic, and this spreads the compound evenly as well

a new flame eater, just to be different

the lap is put in the lathe, the cylinder held in hand, and it is lapped until the feel of the whole of the cylinder is the same, and there are no tight spots.

a new flame eater, just to be different

a piston has to be turned up, so I put a pipe cap on a piece of pipe, and turned the o.d. to just barely fit the bore.

a new flame eater, just to be different

I wrapped the piston with a piece of notebook paper to protect its finish, and bored out the threads, bored to get about a forty thousandths wall, and to get a flat surface parallel to the front face, on the inside

a new flame eater, just to be different

once the piston is ready, I used some polishing compound as a carrier, and will be using jewler's rouge to lap the piston to the cylinder

a new flame eater, just to be different

with the piston screwed to the end of an old throttle shaft of brass out of a carburetor, I've rubbed in the rouge and clamped the shaft in a vise to hold the piston steady

a new flame eater, just to be different

the cylinder is carefully rotated and moved back and forth as it eases into the bore, the compound opening it up just a bit as it goes

a new flame eater, just to be different

a look at the piston with compound blackened by the lapping, ready for fresh compound.

a new flame eater, just to be different

the final lapping is done with both piston and cylinder in hand, for the feel and to be certain any tight spots are found and worked out

a new flame eater, just to be different

with the lapping completed, the cylinder is set up in the milling vise for mounting holes to be center drilled

a new flame eater, just to be different

after which the bolt holes are drilled and tapped

a new flame eater, just to be different

here I'm squaring up the top side of the frame of the engine

a new flame eater, just to be different

flipping it over, getting ready to flycut the bottom side

a new flame eater, just to be different

and flycutting it, using soluable oil for coolant

a new flame eater, just to be different

at this point, it is time to square up the face where the cylinder will mount

a new flame eater, just to be different

flycutting the front face

a new flame eater, just to be different

the final cut, finishing the end

a new flame eater, just to be different

touching off with the end mill, using a cigarette paper to get a dead zero

a new flame eater, just to be different

milling the slot which will set up the thickness of the front face where the cylinder mounts

a new flame eater, just to be different

touching off the back side, again with a cigarette paper for zero clearance on the cutter

a new flame eater, just to be different

touching off the front side, getting ready to mill the slot for the crank assembly

a new flame eater, just to be different

starting the slot, lots of chips and fluid

a new flame eater, just to be different

lots more chips, removing a couple cubic inches of volume

a new flame eater, just to be different

finishing up the slot for the crankshaft, taking light cuts the full depth, and getting the two pillars even in thickness
this about does it for today, more to come soon.  Mad Jack

[saw]

This will be very intressting to follow 

[madjackghengis]

Thanks Saw, well, to start on the crank, I put a piece of free machining inch and three quarters in the lathe, center drilled it, drilled and reamed out a three sixteenths hole, about an inch deep, as the mainshaft holes.  I will be parting off two crank cheeks, after I put the stock in the milling vise and drill and ream the crank pin hole, this ensures the two cheeks will hold the shafts and pin parallel to each other.
a new flame eater, just to be different

with the center hole drilled and reamed, the stock is set up square in the milling vise, and the crank pin hole drilled and reamed

a new flame eater, just to be different

the finished hole will give an inch and an eighth stroke

a new flame eater, just to be different

now it needs to be cut off, and the two crank cheeks faced off parallel to each other

a new flame eater, just to be different

ready to go back in the lathe

a new flame eater, just to be different

two slices a bit over a quarter in thick, enough to face off clean

a new flame eater, just to be different

facing the other side off

a new flame eater, just to be different

setting up the cheeks for balancing holes to be drilled

a new flame eater, just to be different

center drilling, and drilling a pilot hole for each balance hole

a new flame eater, just to be different

opening up the holes to a size which looks good

a new flame eater, just to be different

cleaning up the crank cheeks for locktite to hold the shafts and pin in place

a new flame eater, just to be different

pressing in the crankpin, using a roller bearing in the main shaft holes for alignment

a new flame eater, just to be different

using a piece of tube, a bar, setting up to press in the mainshafts

a new flame eater, just to be different

pressing a shaft home

a new flame eater, just to be different

the assembled crank laying in the slots of the frame

a new flame eater, just to be different

another view of the crank laying in place, that's it for now, more to come soon, Mad Jack

[cfellows]

Nice looking engine.  Will be interesting to see how she runs!

Chuck

[saw]

madjackghengis I have to ask you some questions about the flycut (I'll got min this morning but I have never run it). How fast shell the drill run during flycuting?
How deep can it take? I suppose it deppend on the mill, I'll got an china-mill, a small one.. 

Your progress on youre engine is fantastic. 

[BiggerHammer]

Thank you for showing how you lap your cylinder and piston. Looks much more effective than my method.

[Bogstandard]

Lookin' good Jack.

You seem to be gettin' a bit of a fetish for them thar lickers.

Be careful, they can take over your life.


John

[sbwhart]

Great job Jack,   

All the clutter on your benches is very interesting too, trying to work out what all the bits and pieces are for.

  Yes I know I'm a nosey bugger.

 

Cheers

Stew

[madjackghengis]

Thanks all for the interest, Saw, run your flycutter as fast as you can on aluminum, with as fine an edge as you can hone on it with a stone, and use coolant, try to have the cutter overhang either side by just a little bit, and make sure you're head is trammed (perpendicular to the table) and you'll get a nice finish.  John, it's one of those things that bites you, and then you have this disease , I get too many ideas looking at everyone else's projects, and keep wanting to try them out.  Stew, don't worry about nosey, I can't help but look at all my mate's clutter as well, with interest and wonder, suffice to say some are parts that didn't work but might work on something else, some are potential parts, and some are just clutter, there for confusion's sake.  Mr. Hammer, I learned to lap for fuel pumps for diesels, and for aircraft hydraulics, I can't help it, when I have fine grained cast iron, it demands a finish worthy of its structure and capacity, as it's so easy to work with and get a gorgeous finish.
    I've been busy writing this morning, but I've got more to post, so I will have substantially more posted tomorrow, and maybe a video if I'm lucky.  John, every time I see a flame eater, it's got a different valve arrangement, or some other substantial part is interesting, and I can't seem to not build it into "just one more before I get back to my main post".  Then I also get the comments of those who come into my shop and that just takes me over the top and I've got to grab another piece of cast or billet or something, and get on with the idea.  This engine is your fault, with that crazy valve arrangement   Cheers, Jack

[Bogstandard]

Jack,

I know exactly where you are coming from.

I got enthralled with Chuck's poppet valve engines a while back, and just had to make one, but got carried away experimenting with different cams. It is half way thru a bling exercise, one of the many engines I have to finish off after the proving run. My flame licker takes priority though, that is being finished off first.

This is what I ended up with when I tried to make an engine like Chuck's.

John

[madjackghengis]

So John, you just come back with a challenge of another engine to have to look at and consider making a copy, well, if that's your answer, here's mine

a new flame eater, just to be different

cutting off the end of the con rod shaft stock (the bent end, because this is not an elbow engine)

a new flame eater, just to be different

with the shaft in a spindex, milling the end of the rod flat to go in the gudeon block of the piston

a new flame eater, just to be different

having milled both sides, drilling the gudeon pin hole, a sixteenth of an inch diameter

a new flame eater, just to be different

the big end of the rod will be a two piece design, as in the plans for the poppin', cutting off a piece of bronze for the big end

a new flame eater, just to be different

laying it out for cutting in two

a new flame eater, just to be different

some jobs are just too small for machine work

a new flame eater, just to be different

the two pieces, ready for some machining

a new flame eater, just to be different

both pieces were set up in the vise with a square, I used a three sixteenths end mill to slot the first piece, forgot to take a picture

a new flame eater, just to be different

setting up to machine the second piece to fit the first

a new flame eater, just to be different

starting machining, this will end up a "tongue" to fit in the slot of the other

a new flame eater, just to be different

finishing cut on the first side

a new flame eater, just to be different

finding the second side with a cigarette paper, this side is critical as the fit has to be snug without the solder

a new flame eater, just to be different

second side found, ready to mill

a new flame eater, just to be different

making chips out of bronze

a new flame eater, just to be different

more chips

a new flame eater, just to be different

after measuring, making the final cut

a new flame eater, just to be different

the two pieces slip together just like they were made for each other, then soft soldered, forgot to take a picture oops

a new flame eater, just to be different

clamped in the vise, finding the center line

a new flame eater, just to be different

first, one side

a new flame eater, just to be different

then the other, and center up using the DRO

a new flame eater, just to be different

changing to a pointy wiggler end, to find the end of the "tongue"

a new flame eater, just to be different

found, mill zeroed here for the crank pin

a new flame eater, just to be different

center drilled, ready for drilling for reaming

a new flame eater, just to be different

a new flame eater, just to be different

just under reamer size

a new flame eater, just to be different

the reamer set in place

a new flame eater, just to be different

reaming the crank pin hole

a new flame eater, just to be different

and done, now the clamp hole

a new flame eater, just to be different

centering side to side

a new flame eater, just to be different

center drilling

a new flame eater, just to be different

tap drilling for #4-40 bolt

a new flame eater, just to be different

clearance drilling

a new flame eater, just to be different

tapping for the bolt

a new flame eater, just to be different

reducing the width of the block

a new flame eater, just to be different

and the other side

a new flame eater, just to be different

setting up to reduce the length a bit

a new flame eater, just to be different

first cut, vise not quite tight enough, no problem though

a new flame eater, just to be different

taking off the first corner

a new flame eater, just to be different

and taking off the other

a new flame eater, just to be different

sanding off the burrs

a new flame eater, just to be different

chucking in the four jaw, for the rod hole to be drilled and tapped

a new flame eater, just to be different

after drilling, tapping for the rod

a new flame eater, just to be different

ready for the finishing work

a new flame eater, just to be different

filing the corners for radii

a new flame eater, just to be different

and the second corner, too

a new flame eater, just to be different

cleaned up, burrs removed, ready for un-soldering

a new flame eater, just to be different

solder removed, time to clean it up

a new flame eater, just to be different

another view of the parts

a new flame eater, just to be different

the gudeon block for the piston

a new flame eater, just to be different

milling the end, the other is already tapped for the screw to hold it to the piston

a new flame eater, just to be different

milling the other flat

a new flame eater, just to be different

touching off with the slitting saw

a new flame eater, just to be different

slitting for the connecting rod small end, a sixteenth slot

done and ready to install in the piston.  That's about it for today, more to come tomorrow.  Thanks for watching, cheers, Jack

[saw]

It's always so intressting to follow your'e work. I lifting my hat for the master. 

[Stilldrillin]

By 'ek Jack! 

I knew you were starting another 'licker. But, you've galloped off without me! Where have I been? 

It's all looking really good.....   

Love the big end assembly..... Couldn't work out what you were doing. Until you showed it separated!   

Keep on, keeping on..... 

David D

[dbvandy]

watts dis fancy ma-sheene you doin all theis cuttin on?  Looks x-pen-sive....

 

Doug

[madjackghengis]

Hi Doug, do you mean my Taiwanese mill?  It's only expensive if you consider money as an object, I just consider it a means to increasing my tooling.  It's only taken forty years to build my shop, I figure by the time I reach middle age, I should have a pretty nice set up.  Once I saw the form of big end in the "poppin", I had to make one, and I'm very happy with how it turned out, tight enough to be good bearing, but loose enough to turn freely, and it makes removal of the rod easy, even with the engine fully assembled.  The original rod was a piece of eighth inch rod which I flatted on end in the mill, and drilled a wrist pin hole in, and turned down the other end to about .095 and threaded 4-40, but it was a mite bit long, and when I tried to turn off the extra eighth inch, I broke the threads clean off, so I had to start again on the rod.

a new flame eater, just to be different

I didn't have another piece of eighth inch that was straight, but I found a piece of eighth in key stock, and decided I could mill both sides on one end, in the vise and put a gudeon pin hole in it, and then turn down the other end and thread it at the right length.

a new flame eater, just to be different

using an indicator, I centered it in a four jaw, then stoned the tool, as I always do before a new cut.

a new flame eater, just to be different

I grind the cutter, then lap it on a diamond lap, then I stone it between pieces until it needs grinding again, the tangential holder lets it hold a good edge for a lot of work, and is easy to stone off.

a new flame eater, just to be different

this is my tailstock die holder set up, bought from the son of a machinist who has long since passed, a piece of inch hex stock reamed half in through, with one end bored for five eighths dies, and the other for three quarter inch dies, and four grub screws on each end to hold the dies in.

a new flame eater, just to be different

having turned about three eighths of an in down to .095, I threaded it for 4-40, for the right overall length

a new flame eater, just to be different

and here's the finished rod next to the broken one

a new flame eater, just to be different

a little bit of hand work, putting a radius on the little end with a file

a new flame eater, just to be different

and the other side as well, making it look good, even if it can't be seen

a new flame eater, just to be different

and finished, radii and all

a new flame eater, just to be different

having already put the small end in the gudeon block and screwed it into the piston, it takes a bit of finagling to get the pieces of the rod end around the crankpin without dropping them, and they need to stay oriented right.  I put a small rubber o-ring on each side of the main shaft, for the ball bearings to butt up against, and centered the crank assembly between the pillars before adding the rod and piston assembly.  The rod is locked into the big end with a lock nut, setting minimal clearance on the head end

a new flame eater, just to be different

a bit of a side view of the engine with the rod assembly in place, the square rod being rather easy to align the gudeon pin with the crank pin, and easy to hold while tightening up the lock nut.

a new flame eater, just to be different

I wasn't sure what I was doing with the head when I made it, so it is thick, and needs to be a lot thinner, so the flycutter, at slightly slower speed is used to cut it down to size.

a new flame eater, just to be different

I'd already drilled the head bolt holes, but they don't interfere with reducing the thickness

a new flame eater, just to be different

with the head down to size, its time to counterbore the holes so the bolts are below the surface

a new flame eater, just to be different

finishing up the counter boring

a new flame eater, just to be different

and the finished head, next to the engine.

I've decided what to do for valving, and will be posting that next probably, and then maybe a test run.  Cheers,  Jack

[NickG]

Brilliant work there Jack, just found this. I love your tweaks on the design and the angles used. 

Watching avidly.

Nick

[cfellows]

Really like the aesthetics of this engine.  It's a very pleasing design.  By the way, do you stone the tangential cutter on the top, flat part or on the sides and leading corner?

Chuck

[madjackghengis]

Thanks Nick, this has been a learning experience all the way along.  Hi all, getting close to a finished engine, so here's today's installment.

a new flame eater, just to be different

a piece of brass round has been bored out for a flywheel, so I've turned a piece of steel for the hub, and I'm center drilling it in preparation for drilling and reaming to fit the main shaft

a new flame eater, just to be different

I missed a picture of drilling, but here's reaming it out to three sixteenths

a new flame eater, just to be different

facing off the end of the hub and ensuring the shoulder is square with the bore

a new flame eater, just to be different

setting the hub up for grub screws, I like to put two at least, and at 90 degrees for security

a new flame eater, just to be different

centering the spindle over the hub

a new flame eater, just to be different

center drilling the first grub screw hole

a new flame eater, just to be different

tap drilling the first hole

a new flame eater, just to be different

tapping the first hole, the second hole is treated the same, using the tap drill in the tapped hole as a guide to getting the second hole at 90 degrees from the first

a new flame eater, just to be different

having centered up the cam blank, drilling the center hole for the first grub screw

a new flame eater, just to be different

tap drilling the cam blank

a new flame eater, just to be different

tapping the grub screw hole, 4-40

a new flame eater, just to be different

setting up for the second grub screw hole, note the tap drill sticking out to the right

a new flame eater, just to be different

center drilling again

a new flame eater, just to be different

flywheel bored and faced for the hub

a new flame eater, just to be different

hub pressed in, facing off the other side holding the hub

a new flame eater, just to be different

flywheel and cam, ready for mounting on the main shafts

a new flame eater, just to be different

with a grub screw on the end of the allen wrench, the cup is stoned flat to keep from scoring the shaft  I will have to adjust the cam some, and don't want the shaft all buggered up

a new flame eater, just to be different

valve lever blanks, ready for hole drilling

a new flame eater, just to be different

drilling the first of many holes

a new flame eater, just to be different

filing the first of many radii on valve train gear

a new flame eater, just to be different

the main valve actuating arm with its follower bearing riveted in place

a new flame eater, just to be different

two connecting link plates, clamped for drilling holes

a new flame eater, just to be different

holes drilled for the arm, the valve pin, and for the pivot rivet to hold them to the valve levers

a new flame eater, just to be different

setting up to cut off the rivet, a brass brad from a box of picture hangers

a new flame eater, just to be different

cutting off the rivet, draw sawing for control

a new flame eater, just to be different

the main lever in place with the valve link riveted in place

a new flame eater, just to be different

the cam back off the engine, getting a flat milled so I can set the valve at its open point

a new flame eater, just to be different

getting the flat down to the hub diameter, minus a hair for filing

a new flame eater, just to be different

with the valve lever in place, some idea of location established with the flat, drilling the generator brush for the valve pin which will carry it.  The pin is about .093 diameter, with .040 pins machined on each end, it came like this out of a CD player or something, and happened to be the right width for the head, and already have pins machined

a new flame eater, just to be different

having set up the valve, the cam is removed again, to get its second flat milled, to make it proper timing

a new flame eater, just to be different

several passes later, the cam is on its final cut

a new flame eater, just to be different

the cam, ready for some filing to remove the sharp corners, and make for smooth valve opening and closing

a new flame eater, just to be different

not quite done, but ready for a trial run.  You have to test things like cam timing and how things like the linkage work.

a new flame eater, just to be different

engine disassembled for drilling mounting holes, all the parts spread out

a new flame eater, just to be different

drilling the mounting holes for mounting on some brown stuff

a new flame eater, just to be different

after the first run, I found the levers of the valve gear wrong, and remade them a quarter of an inch longer so the valve would stay flat against the head, something it quit doing in the first run.  I didn't take pictures of cutting out new brass levers, but do show how I finish the flat pieces for a good finish.

a new flame eater, just to be different

another view of the surface plate, 18 by 24 by 4 inches

a new flame eater, just to be different

I decided I needed more flywheel, so I took a piece of steel shaft, a bronze gear with its teeth eaten away, and made a hub, then pressed on the old gear, and turned the o.d. smooth

a new flame eater, just to be different

cutting off the hub

a new flame eater, just to be different

the hub and old gear ready to be mated

a new flame eater, just to be different

centering for drilling grub screws

a new flame eater, just to be different

using a long center drill, center drilling the hub

a new flame eater, just to be different

after tap drilling, tapping the hub

a new flame eater, just to be different

setting up for the second grub screw, same as the first

a new flame eater, just to be different

again, stoning off the cup of the screw

a new flame eater, just to be different

with the head at .300 in thick, I found I needed to bore a taper as the straight port seemed to "quench" the flame as it went in, the angle is such that the diameter of the conical port is bore diameter at the head surface, and has about .020 in thickness on the face end

a new flame eater, just to be different

having seen several such engines with pressure relief valves of sorts, I decided one might help the running of this engine, so I used a #1 center drill, and drilled in the top center of the head till the tip of the center drill just pierced the port.  I'd found a ball bearing which measures .112, which dropped nicely into the .125 hole the body of the center drill left.

a new flame eater, just to be different

another view of the head and the center drill.  I also drilled a .140 hole deep enough to leave about an .100 in of the center drill hole, the full taper seat of the center drill for the ball to seat on, but with plenty of room for excess air to escape

a new flame eater, just to be different

here you can see the tapered port, and the pressure relief hole just entering it

a new flame eater, just to be different

another view of the head, relief hole and check ball

a new flame eater, just to be different

I had left the head square for surface area for the valve, but found no need, so turned it round to reduce the mass of the head

a new flame eater, just to be different

I bolted the head on the cylinder, centered it up, and turned it down, here it is done, with the relief port on top

a new flame eater, just to be different

I almost lost the ball testing to see if it worked, and put the head in the mill vise to drill a hole for a pin to retain the ball.  The pin hole goes through from the cylinder surface, through the relief hole, and just starts in the front surface of the head, it is .042 as I have some .041 spring wire to use for the pin.

a new flame eater, just to be different

drilling from the cylinder side

a new flame eater, just to be different

drilled, ready to clean all the swarf out of tiny holes

a new flame eater, just to be different

head, check ball, and retaining pin

a new flame eater, just to be different

this is the first run after fixing the valve gear, but before the check valve was added, this run was the reason for the check ball.

a new flame eater, just to be different

And here is the last run of the engine, with the check ball, and everything completed except its own burner, which will probably be modelled after John's butane burner from his flame eater, as I like the clean burning and the ability to adjust the flame and thus the speed.  I hope you all enjoyed this as much as I have.    Cheers, Jack

[madjackghengis]

Hi Chuck, the beauty of the tangential tool is the ease of grinding, just straight in, at an angle to form a diamond shape, and then I lap the end on a diamond hone, just until there is enough for two edges, and touch up the two sides, and the intersecting corner which is a small radius after numerous lappings.  I just stone the top face when changing metals, or when I see some build up in the edge.  Any dullness showing up means hitting the grinder and lapping the top again.  It's one of my favorite tool holders.  Jack

[Bogstandard]

That is a real stunner Jack, very well done indeed. 

I am wondering why my one wasn't fed under the block rather than from the top, it would have saved a lot of hassle.

You seem to be able to get them done a lot quicker than me, I am only half way thru the flywheel bling, weeks still to go yet.


John

[saw]

Just beutifull. 

[Stilldrillin]

Great to see it running Jack. 

So quickly too! 

Well done...... 

David D

[spuddevans]

That's a real nice runner there Jack

Tim

[madjackghengis]

Thanks very much for watching and the comments.  The posting is a bit deceptive, I've been working on it for some time, I've just not have time post, as I've had some weeks of drs. appts. and the like, taking up all my mornings and "extra" time.  I've been working with a friend getting his custom bike fired up and broke in, thirty years collecting, three years building, and about three weeks doing the initial fixes and alterations, jetting, making things never together before, play nicely.  A lot of time supervising, with constant interuptions to do something I have to do as it's ticklish.  It's almost easier to do the "shake-down and break in" hours and miles myself.
    By the way John, it was in watching the video of your engine which inspired me to flip the valve levers, and have the valve slide up.  And Nick, you mentioned having the cam close the valve, and let the spring open the valve when the pressure rises, so I used the same concept with the slide valve as well as on the oddball.  The check ball was the reason for a thick head and it makes the engine run very smoothly and rather quietly and makes the engine warm up very quickly.  It runs at a steady 550 rpm after about a minute of running.  I rinse the cylinder with WD-40 before starting, drying the outside, and spinning the liquid out of the cylinder, then set it down, light the burner and spin it over.  I believe I can reduce the cleaning if I run it off butane instead of the alki.  I just need to scale down your burner to fit the port.  You've all been an inspiration to my experimenting and provide lots of food for thought.   Cheers, Jack

[sbwhart]

Great Job Jack 

And a real smashing runner

I learnt a lot from following your thread thanks for showing. 
 


Stew