Puma / Dorman 6LE / MacFarlane B46B / 110 kVA Generator Resurrection

[AdeV]

Anyone want 4 wheelbarrow loads of sawdust!

...or to give it it's proper name: Spilt oil absorber...!

If I was more local to you than completely on the other end of the country, I'd take you up on that!

[awemawson]

Probably too wet for that Ade.

At long last the plumbing bits for the diesel pump tail side have arrived, so I was able to fit them this morning and try the pump at last. Glad to say that it works splendidly, though I may fit a length of hard steel pipe to the end of the flexy hose, as the flexy tends to curl away from the bottom of the Jerry Can stopping it being fully emptied. I could go the whole hog and fit a foot valve and filter unit which would weigh it down, but I don't think that's justified unless I happen to have one kicking about (vague memory of one somewhere!)

[mc]

Sawdust briquette press for your next project?

[awemawson]

Too late Morray, it's on the compost heap with the piggy poo 

[awemawson]

At last progress with the exhaust system 

My friend Johnny had kindly tigged up the flexy to my manifold adaptor a couple of weeks ago, but I've not been able to get on with it due to other commitments.

First off I assembled the various bits of plumbing and set it in place on a baulk of timber - it's not self supporting due to the flexy section. This allowed me to make some measurements and get a better idea of what was possible. Two  76 mm exhaust clamps are fitted round the inlet and outlet pipes, and their 8 mm threaded studs take 5 inch long hexagonal pillars tapped 8 mm female both ends. The lower ends of these pillars take anti-vibration mounts, also conveniently threaded 8 mm that fix on a 6 mm steel plate 760 mm long and 150 mm wide. This not only acts as a supporting member but will hopefully also act as a bit of a heat shield. The front part of this steel plate will be supported by a vertical 6 mm plate bolted to the shutter assembly, and the rear will be supported by a pair of 10 inch high hexagonal pillars fixed to the radiator cross bracing bar.

The block of wood that it was resting on got in the way so I had to find some way of supporting the silencer temporarily in mid air  to allow me to assemble bits as I made them and hence measure up for the next bit as this is very bespoke!

Fortunately some time ago my friend Pete had given me some  scrapped handrails that used 'Tube Clamps' which let me make up a temporary scaffold projecting a tube into the outlet of the silencer to stop it sagging.

I made up wooden mock ups of the supports to check sizes, and so far have made the 10" long threaded hexagonal pillars that support the rear, the Loctite on the male studs is setting as I type, but I wont cut and fix the front plate until they are in place, as things tend to move about a bit and sizes change!

 

[awemawson]

So today the bolts forming the male studs on the rear pillars got truncated, I made the front vertical plate to support the horizontal plate along with the joining bit of angle iron and bolted it all together.

So the silencer is now properly supported, the temporary scaffolding could be taken down, and I did a trial run just to ensure that it doesn't shake itself to pieces - it doesn't 

I think apart from moving it to it's final resting place all that is left is to source some suitable high temperature paint and paint the silencer and it's fixings - I do have the remains of a rattle can of 'High Temperature Matt Black Hammerite' that claims to withstand 600 deg C but it must be decades old and anyway there probably isn't enough in the can. I suppose BBQ paint is the stuff to look for  Any suggestions welcome.

[RussellT]

I have used Sperex Exhaust Paint with reasonable success in the past.  It now seems to be a Simoniz product.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Simoniz-Very-Termperature-Paint-500ml/dp/B003N9QL8U

Russell

[Pete.]

My mate used to paint his bike exhausts with barbecue paint. Only problem was petrol would take it right off.

[awemawson]

Tomorrow I am hoping to put this generator under a little load. Other than measuring it's output voltage, and the minuscule current that the controller and instrumentation take, it has not been loaded in my ownership.

Now in the Tractor Shed I have a rather large Hydrovane compressor (*). At 18.5 kW it should be be a small load for the generator, but again this piece of equipment has not been tested in my ownership as it's 35 amp running current is a bit too large for the local wiring. So i t will be two firsts tomorrow 

BUT I had parked the Hydrovane too close to the wall to get at it's electrical input, and the generator was blocking access for the Forklift Truck. Even the Pallet Truck wouldn't work as the Hydrovane fork pockets were too far apart.

So my job this evening was to improvise using a scaffold pole and two 'Railway Jacks' to lift it high enough for the pallet truck to move it away from the wall.

I had already dug out a 125 amp plug and a suitable length of 4 core 6 mm (51 amp rated) SWA cable earlier in the day.

So listen for loud bangs tomorrow morning 


(* Featured in this thread https://madmodder.net/index.php/topic,12963.msg155283.html#msg155283 )

[John Rudd]

All will be well, 18kva is small potatoes

[awemawson]

Well that went spiffingly -NOT 

This morning I did a bit of pruning and removed the remote control wiring and power wiring to the big Hydrovane compressor.

Then apparently it was ESSENTIAL that I visited a local cliff at the seaside where fossils could be found - OK nice flask of coffee and back home for lunch (with no fossils!).

So the afternoon was spent making off the 6 mm four core SWA cable -  one end to flying leads, the other to a 125 Amp male plug. Amazingly stiff stuff that cable, but job done. Then flying leads made off to the compressor having first modified it's termination box to take a 20 mm SWA gland (original was 38 mm. Slight issue with the compressor panel isolator switch that wouldn't mate with it's actuator rod. Decided to fly by the seat of my pants and have the panel open and operate the switch internally.

Time to try things out

Started the generator, turn on the switch on the 125 amp socket (which felt a bit wishy washee) - turn on the compressor inside the panel and . . . . . . . NOTHING 

Out with the voltmeter - no volts in the compressor panel  - go to the generator to turn off and remove the plug - no chance - plug stuck FIRMLY in it's socket - what the heck 

Now this socket is interlocked. It can only be turned on if a plug is inserted, and the plug cannot be removed unless it is turned off. OK after MUCH investigation I find that the operating shaft for it's switch has not engaged properly, knocking the actual switch unit off it's DIN rail and JAMMING THE INTERLOCK  This must have happened the last time that I put the fascia back on the socket.


Now this socket is designed such that you cannot get into it if switched on with a plug in it - exactly what I had. Two hours later, with much careful bending of plastic, poking and prodding eventually I break into this inner sanctum to reveal that the plastic retainers for the switch onto the DIN rail had broken. Getting a bit fed up by this time, so I carefully re-assembled the 125 amp switch on it's DIN rail, and applied hot melt glue in places that I sincerely hope will fix it in the correct place, then beat a retreat for a restorative Gin and Tonic.

Tomorrow the glue should be good and hard so I can start again, but initially I'm going to remove the interlock to avoid a repeat performance.

. . . at least nothing went bang 

[Pete.]

Those damn interlock outlets I hate them with a passion. I can't tell you how many times I've been in that situation. If I have to use them on site I always grease the plug up so it slides in and out very easily because some of them you can get the plug not quite in far enough for the interlock to release properly and invariably something expensive breaks. If it's not that it's neanderthal operatives who don't undestand what an interlock is, but manage to unplug it anyway, destroying the mechanism.

I don't think I've ever seen one on site that lasted the job out intact.

[awemawson]

I went back out after supper and re-wired the main output switch - the heavy cables were still trying to pull it off it's mounting - I had to dress them back with a soft faced mallet quite brutally.

The interlock mechanism isn't going to jam again Pete, as I removed it and it's labelled up in a plastic bag in the cabinet 

I also manage to sort the cabinet interlock on the compressor itself, so hopefully ready for a re-run of the tests tomorrow - even here I daren't make the noise at this time of night !

[mattinker]

. . . at least nothing went bang

[awemawson]

. . . and still hasn't Matthew 

Bright and early this morning I started up the generator and had another go. Control panel gave an error message saying that the main motor over-current trip had triggered:

Poking about in the compressor panel I found the offending breaker and reset it and tried again, this time it appeared that the motor actually started on power up despite being in manual mode, then reported an input over temperature alarm

So intensive study of the manual that I have, that refers to a controller that is markedly different to the one fitted, it can be configured to the in Auto or Manual mode and obviously I need to change it to manual. Nine buttons on my model, six in the manual and only a couple correspond 

I then opened up the covers to the compressor and found that the motor was warm. Could it perhaps be turning in the wrong direction? I had been extremely careful to keep the phases consistent  wiring up the generator, it's output socket, the interconnecting cable and the connection in the compressor panel, however probably worth a try. Two phases swapped  on the compressor input terminals and the generator re-started and another test.

Guess what, again it auto started, but this time with a blast of air emitting from the output pipe - cannot stop it with a hand over it, hand blows off at about 2 bar !

Load on the generator is barely discernible - the current meter moves just a tiny amount so I need to put a clamp ammeter on a cable the actually measure it.

[PekkaNF]

Good job. Where do you think phase swap has been done? Usually in the easiest point at the either end of the power cable.

[awemawson]

At the moment I've swapped it inside the compressor control panel, being the easiest option. I need to hook up a 'known motor' to the generator and prove that it's o/p is correct and if not swap it. I do actually have a phase rotation meter tucked away somewhere so I suppose I really should give it an outing to the real world!

[awemawson]

So it turns out that the generator is putting out the phases in the wrong rotational direction. Very odd - the wires from the alternator itself are very clearly colour coded and these codings were followed all the way to the output socket. However I've now reversed L1 & L2.

This was proved with my Phase Rotation Meter - for some reason I can't download the video I took from my 'phone although it plays on the 'phone  This meter is basically a little motor spinning a disk whose direction indicates phasing.

So connections returned to standard on the Hydrovane control panel, and another test run with a clamp meter on phase 1, showing a 'rest' running current of 34.8 which is pretty well spot on the motor plate figure.

. . .still a puzzle why the main alternator is wrongly marked 

[PekkaNF]

uuuh....???? alternator magnetizing circuit polarity?

[awemawson]

Trying to get my head around that but I don't think that it would change the order of the phases, just the phase of the phases 

Have a picture of the phase rotation meter just for the sake of completeness !

[awemawson]

Innovative use of Technology 


We have had a LOT of rain in the last few days resulting in our 10 acre field flooding to an average of four inches (*) (local river tops it's banks and comes visiting), so it  was no surprise to find a small puddle on the floor of the tractor shed under the generator but directly under the join in two roofing sheets.

But the timing seems strange - not directly as the heavens opened but some time later, so perhaps a  small coolant leak, but the water in the puddle looked very clear - how to prove it one way or the other 

Well when filling the coolant up I had no idea if there was any anti-freeze in it or if so at what concentration, so I bought a cheap Brix diffraction meter calibrated in percentage Glycol. This will tell me if it's coolant or not!

With 15%  Glycol it's certainly NOT a roof leak, we have a minor coolant leak. Sure enough I found a flange with four studs that allowed a good turn per stud - it MAY be the leak but anyway I'm satisfied now what I need to look for !

(I calculate that we received AT LEAST 4,500 TONS of water yesterday - probably much more as it runs off pretty fast - most was gone by lunchtime today)
 

[awemawson]

I finally got the exhaust & Silencer assembly back on this morning, having given it a couple of coats of 'Stove Paint' - in matt black. Amazingly it took a full can and a half of aerosol (400 ml cans).

The exhaust manifold really should have a coat or two as well, but it's a horrid shape to mask up for spraying and I've not yet found a source of brushing stove paint.

Ran the generator up this morning to bake the paint - I was expecting quite a pong but it was surprisingly odourless 

Update: I have now found a source of brushing high temperature matt black stove paint, but it won't be here now until second week of January, by which time I'll be in Barcelona !

[awemawson]

I've been chasing a small but persistent coolant leak for a few days, and eventually traced it to the flange between the head and the thermostat housing casting. I wanted to fix it before moving the generator to it's new home as it is far easier to get at things  where it is. The leak was dripping onto the charging alternator so definitely needed fixing.

There is a cross bar, bolted to the front engine lifting eye, that supports braces for the radiator, and this bar had been installed resting on the aluminium casting of the thermostat housing - probably for ease of setting out when it was built. This was no issue until I used the same cross bar to support the weight of the silencer. This weight was putting a shear force on the sealing flange and probably caused the leak in the first place.

The solution that I came up with was to raise the bar 6 mm and give it positive location not by resting on the casting, but by a pair of 1" angle iron verticals bolted to the generator chassis.

Verticals measured and test fitted then blown over with a coat of the same blue hammer finish paint, and put on one side whilst I investigated the thermostat housing / flange / gasket etc. Dismantling involved removing the associated rubber coolant hoses, an action that was far easier to write about than do! I'd hoped that I could re-use the originals, but they are rather manky. New silicone ones ordered (FOUR different diameters! 45, 47 50 and 51 mm!)

Unbolting the leaking flange I was surprised to see that it held two thermostats, each operating at 74 degrees C, and plumbed in parallel, presumably to double the flow

Cleaning things up I drew up the gasket flange in Autocad, ported it over to the laser cutter as a DXF and cut some gaskets in two different gasket materials. The removed gasket looks to have been a cork one and hand cut, with bits over laying the thermostat bore in places. I'm not sure how thick it needs to be to set the right 'pinch'  for the thermostats, hence cutting a few. I tested the thermostats in boiling water to prove that they opened - I didn't measure the temperature but frankly it's not that important so long as they open!

Hoses not arriving until middle of next week by which time I'll be in Barcelona, so play will resume when I return.

[awemawson]

I had a pleasant surprise on Saturday evening when a knock at the door announced a Hermes delivery with my hoses that weren't due to arrive until Tuesday.

So today I set too. All fairly straight forwards but actually not simple as everything is extremely tight both to fit and to get at.

I started by fitting the cast elbow with it's two (different diameter !) hoses then moved on to the thermostat housing. As I had anticipated, the gasket thickness was critical, and initially assembling it with a single thin paper gasket I could slip a 5 thou feeler gauge between the faces when bolted up tight as the thermostats themselves were being pinched.  I ended up using the two red fibre gaskets which are each just under 1 mm and it tightened up seemingly OK.

Filling it up with the six gallons of coolant that I'd drained off for this exercise all seemed well. I started it up and watched it running for five minutes while I cleared away my tools.  Still all seemed well so I left it running while I cleaned myself up and downloaded these pictures allowing time for the generator to come up to temperature.

Going back to turn it off there was water EVERYWHERE    The hose clip on the end of the heat exchanger  had worked it's way off the end of the pipe 

Now it had been murder tight but these silicone hoses are quite slippery and the pipes that they go onto have a cast in bulge to help sealing but in this case it leaves very little room between the end of the bulge and the end of the hose for a clip to sit, and if it's too close to the  bulge you are tightening the clip on a tapering bit of pipe, which is what I think had happened.

Never mind, forgo lunch, drain down again, and re-make the joint

Second time round we seem to be OK - I left it again to come up to temperature, and, fingers crossed I think we are OK.

All a bit of a pain but at least it's done 

[awemawson]

One last job to do to complete the 'vermin barriers' on the generator - cover the holes in the bell housing.

I've been telling myself for a while that there is no need to do this, they just give access to where a clutch could be housed (although of course there is not one fitted) so just the engine to alternator coupling in there - no insulated wires to tempt them in to chew.

But the realisation that if a rat or more likely a squirrel, were to set up home in there, and I then started the generator, clearing out the ensuing mess would NOT be pleasant 

So - simple job, draw up a cover taking it's mesh size from the existing ones that are on the alternator itself, and CNC plasma two (one each side), slap a coat of paint on, drill and tap holes in the bell housing to retain them then off for a cup of tea.

. . . well jobs don't always go to plan do they 

The cast iron of the bell housing must be well chilled - it is as hard as a witches t*****y. Wanted to tap it M4, so 3.3 mm tapping drill. First drill bit went nowhere - never mind I have the remains of a box of ten HSS 3.3 drills. Next one blunted almost immediately. No cobalt drill in this size, so tried a 2.5 mm that I had to hand - it made a hole and then snapped on break through.

. . . so I've ordered up some 3.3 mm Cobalt drills, and when they arrive we'll see how gently I can drill some more holes. The tapping might get interesting as well !