Gasless mig?

[jemglen]

Anyone got anything good to say about gasless mig?

I'm heartily sick of my SIP Turbo 130 gas mig which seems to require endless 'petting' before it can be persuaded to weld anything  (admittedly it's usually an age between outings) and welding outside (as I was last week while building a stand for my pillar drill and grinder) is just a waste of time, annoying porous welds that have to be cleaned up and welded afresh.

I decided to buy a cheap gasless from say, Screwfix (about £80) or B&Q but a bit of research turns up almost limitless doubters on the merits (or otherwise!) of gasless. 

So I wondered whether anyone had had any good experiences of going gasless. Principle uses would be Land Rover, trike frame and bits and pieces around the workshop -- ie nothing that has to be terribly pretty!

Yes, the wire's more expensive but judging by the prices on Ebay for a reel, not that much more 

Jerry
 

[Darren]

Don't bother, honestly just don't throw your money away.

I had one of these when I started to build my Locost 7 from scratch. I struggled, and struggled with it.

Then I bought a proper mig, a CEM MIG 150 amp, oh what a joy to use. Never looked back since.
That was stollen some time ago. Recently I bought a Sealey 210 Amp from a local auction, £200 if I remember rightly.
Hadn't welded for about 10 years and then I did this......http://madmodder.net/index.php?topic=533.0

You can't go wrong with a decent welder.

By all means go for the gasless, but you'll never get a decent smooth weld with it. Nor will it be powerful enough to to weld box sections and the like properly. They will be weak welds.

[jemglen]

Well I did say I'd only read bad things about gasless

Very nice welds Darren, especially given that you hadn't welded anything for a while  I've had welds like that from my 130 Turbo but it seems to require a lot of messing about before any welding gets underway… sorting gas leaks, wire sticking and stuttering and so on, and trying to weld outside is just a waste of time 

Has * anyone* a good opinion of gasless?

[Bernd]

Jerry,

Before buying another welder, have you ever thought about putting up a sheild around you to keep any breeze out?

Bernd

[jemglen]

I did try to construct a kind of welding 'bay' using hardboard sheets and also chose a really still day to do the welding but it seems as though even a breath of air is enough to disperse the gas and spoil the weld (could be an old saying right: 'spare the gas and spoil the weld'  ).

The welder always needs TLC to coax it back to life. The rubber seal in the regulator had perished allowing the gas to escape, the wire was spotted with rust etc etc it's always a pain. I'm not a 'tool polisher' but I do look after my stuff and keep it in good order so that it's ready to work. The welder is the one tool that seems always to be broken. 

I figured that maybe buying a cheap gasless would a. remove one primary source of breakdowns and b. allow me to weld outside but the prevailing wisdom is definitely against gasless!

[Terje]

I think the main reason to avoid the gasless mig are that the fumes are give a high risk of cancer... very toxic stuff.
-But if clean and high quality welding are desired, why not look into tig? It gives great control and no sparks flying around, and easily welding very thin material.

[Darren]

I'd love to try tig welding   

[Terje]

You can get fairly low cost welders that can do both tig and rod. I have one from Kemppi: http://www.kemppi.com/inet/kemppi/en/akp.nsf/frameset/Frameset?OpenDocument&left=/inet/kemppi/en/akp.nsf/WEB_Nav?OpenView&navcat=Search&main=/inet/kemppi/frontpage.nsf/0/2D1C6A77EDA18CB0C225718400067C31?opendocument&top=/inet/kemppi/en/akp.nsf/Top?ReadForm&topcat=Product%20Info
It's a great little machine, that I've used a lot. The drawback on these types of welders are that the tig function has scratch ignition and a manual valve on the for opening the gas flow so it uses a little more gas and the arc is either on or off. -But it works just fine, I've used mine proffesionally.
Though mostly when doing tig jobs, I've used an older yet lot more sophisticated lincoln welder with ajustable up and down slope along with some other nice functions like pulse and such. Go for a used well maintained one, and you'll have a friend for years to come.

When it comes to controle, 'i feel there's reaylly nothing to beat the tig. You need a clean surface though, with no rust or grease or other contaminations...