Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe !!!!

[awemawson]

Then there has been a bit of a break through on the controller front. Readers may remember that I could not get the original '6 slot' controller to work. I was getting 'bus errors' reported when the 'user plc' was run. The machine obviously needs the correct software to run correctly - this comprises an eprom set on the main processor card, an eprom set on the 'Mem A0 & MemA1' cards that hold the system PLC program, and an eprom set on the 'MC481' 'User PLC Cartridge'. I had been advised that I needed V18 of this later unit - this is the label on it:

[awemawson]

I wrongly assumed that the V 018 was version 18 oh no that's V 22 

With the correct user plc cartridge now when I try the 6 slot controller I no longer get the 'bus error' which I assume was the program addressing non-existant memory.

Whilst all this was going on, my mole on the Traub help desk decided to go on a fortnights holiday so it is only today that I can confirm various points. I suspect that one of the axis servo amplifiers is faulty but haven't had the time to get my teeth into it. Now the software issues are hopefully behind me it may just be a parameter issue.

The system reports it's firmware state when eventually you find how (!) and the first picture is how it was, and the second how it now is

[vtsteam]

Good work! Particularly with all the other concerns. Gratifying screen!   

[dsquire]

Awemawson

Thanks for the update and glad to hear that you are making progress on getting everything tracked down. 

We the readers and followers on this thread sometimes tend to forget that the author of this thread has more to do than just trouble shoot a CNC mill. 

Carry on with the important task of refurbishing house and home. We will be here waiting as you have the time and/or patience to continue trouble shooting the mill. 

Cheers 

Don

[awemawson]

I actually managed to spend a little time with The Beast today! For some very strange reason the machine is set up with an 'extra' X axis!!!!

We should have:

X1 = lathe tool in / out radially
Z1 = lathe tool in/out axially
C1 = rotary position of the main spindle
C2 = rotary position of the auxiliary spindle
V1 = axial position of the auxiliary spindle

BUT .... we also have X2. Now I hadn't realised the significance of this, but  my contact at Traub pointed it out as the reason we are getting an "Y03 - Amplifier Unequipped - X" error. He had sent me various settings in the parameters for me to check, as well as the parameters for the next machine made on the production line (s/n 334 mine being 333) which is basically the same machine but sold in France so all the text is different. Not over come the extra displayed axis. I can get it removed from the screen displays ok but then the 'opposing / auxiliary amplifier' never gets initialised. Then the machine displays an 'mcp error' (addressing error in the servo amps) and very obscurely in this state prevents the RS232 port working. As soon as you try to use it it reports "IO_Stop". Re-instate the axis settings and the port works ---- argh !

When I was given the Optical Tool Setter there was a second, apparently original paper tape of the parameters tucked away in it's box. I thought that it would be a good idea to try and upload it to a pc and see if it made any difference. Loads of problems loading it - after much searching I found two places where the sprocket holes had never been punched in the factory. Yes that took lots of finding. When I hand punched the missing holes and got it loaded it compared as the same as the other copy.

Still I see today's work as progress of a sort, and I'm increasingly confident that the errors remaining are settings issues.

[Henning]

I can't wait to see some parts produced, but in the meantime, the sheer awesomnes of your project keeps me on my toes 

Impressive!

[vtsteam]

After this tremendous project, the first parts produced are probably going to be the cranks for a small manual lathe!

 

[awemawson]

So just to prove I've not been entirely idle a little bit of a progress report:

(Times been short, since my last post I've built and tiled a porch and a gas bottle store, repaired a 'post knocker' for the tractor and put in 100 metres of stock fence, done a few trips to the abattoir - and occasionally escaped to the work-shop).

 I decided that one issue I ought to be able to fix relatively easily was the 'X Axis Overload Trip' error. I had already proved that the proximity sensor for this was indeed giving an output, so the error report was genuine, and if I fiddled the output electrically the report was cancelled. So the task was to expose the sensor and see if either the sensor was faulty or the overload clutch had tripped. Easy to say, but the X axis assembly is a huge enclosed lump that holds not only the servo motor for the X axis drive, but also the rotation drive for the tool turret, and also the motor that powers the active tooling in the turret. All this is enclosed in tin work to keep coolant and swarf at bay, and is swathed in screws (why use so many different head styles  Three hex socket sizes,  slotted screws and bolt heads!)

Eventually got the covers off:

[awemawson]

To expose the innards:

[awemawson]

Can you see the sensor?

No - nor could I !!!!!

I could feel it, I could see it and the overload clutch using a mirror, but only by climbing inside the lathe and standing on the swarf conveyor.

Clutch had not tripped, but sensor was loose in its clamp, had rattled too close to the bit of the clutch it had to monitor and hence had given the error. Quick tweak with an allen key and error now cleared - only took two days of odd hours to get at it 

Still it's IS progress

[awemawson]

The inductive proximity sensor shows up in picture 1448 in case you haven't spotted it. (Camera being held over the back of the assembly)

(And for those of you worried that that gate lead nowhere - here it is with the grass just beginning to grow where that huge pile of earth was)

[dsquire]

The inductive proximity sensor shows up in picture 1448 in case you haven't spotted it. (Camera being held over the back of the assembly)

(And for those of you worried that that gate lead nowhere - here it is with the grass just beginning to grow where that huge pile of earth was)

awemawson

I always figured that you would find a good use for that gate even though it did seem to be out in the middle of nowhere. With all that you have been up to, it's making me tired just reading about it.

I think that I managed to find the sensor now that you told us where to look. Glad to see that it was an easy fix and cheap. Let's hope that they are all like that. I'll be following along as you solve the next piece of the puzzle.

Cheers

Don

[vtsteam]

One more task off the list!   

[RussellT]

I'm reading this thinking that soon we're going to be reading about it making chips.  Well done.

Projects like this one always make me wonder how the machine got into that state though.  I can see that if the machine stopped working it could be sold - but then you'd expect to find one fault - or one fault and some sign of bodging the others.  In practice though you find several faults that have apparently developed simultaneously while the machine hasn't been touched - usually on those things that you buy thinking "It'll be a simple fix".

Russell

[awemawson]

Well in fairness I never expected it to be an easy fix. The previous owner had sporadically tried over a period of more than a year. He did involve the makers who diagnosed some of the problems with the controller, but he couldn't afford their quoted estimate of about £7K for parts to fix the controller. Unfortunately I think I'm now finding not only the original problems, but those introduced by the several people who have gone this way before me. However I'm pretty sure now that the hardware of the controller is ok - I'm down to the options & parameters that tell it what to do, and it's various peripheral bits and bobs like servo amps, sensors, etc. However I WILL GET THERE (someday!)

There are two dual 'zero speed relays' that monitor the various axis servo motors and form part of the safety chain preventing the cabinet door being opened when they were turning. I know one at least is faulty, and currently I have linked  all four sections out in the relay logic so I can continue fault finding. They are rather obscure however eBay in the US has produced one for me which arrived today. I suspect they are fixable, and now I have a spare I'll venture inside a faulty one and see if they respond to diagnosis.

This is what they look like:

[awemawson]

Managed to get time this morning to fit the spare "Zero Speed Relay" and as far as I can tell with the machine static, it seems to do what it is supposed to.

Having removed the faulty one this has allowed me to open it up and investigate - this is how it is constructed:

[awemawson]

The cards unplug :

[awemawson]

And seem to comprise two identical detector cards:

[awemawson]

And what I assume is a Power Supply card:

[awemawson]

This is pretty certainly the fault as there is what I assume was once a resistor looking rather sorry for itself:

[awemawson]

The unit runs off 24v DC but the sensors, which are two terminal inductive ones, are biased by an 8v internally generated supply that currently is giving 24v !

I think it must be a chopper / switched mode type but as yet I've not done anything other than a visual inspection. There is a pair of mystery components that will probably end up being transformers, but that's just a guess at the moment - my googling on the numbers hasn't given me any pointers:

[vtsteam]

Nice -- its own little bus. Makes it easier to work on. No wonder they are expensive!

Seems you have a good chance of repairing it/them. 

[awemawson]

Things progress apace!

The two 'Zero Speed' relays form two chains of contacts in the safety interlock circuit. A 'normally open' chain, and a 'normally closed' chain. The previous owner had wired out one half of the faulty relay. When I installed the replacement, I decided to strip out the wiring for both contact chains, and re-wire them. I did this mainly as the wiring was a bit tatty and several wires were not numbered and identified - it was easier to start again and do it properly. Turns out the previous chap mixed up two contacts.

Having finished the re-wire I powered up  and started the controller, and thought - hang on that start up sequence sounds unfamiliar. Different relays clicking etc, then all the servo and axis drives came up with an unfamiliar code on their displays. I went round the front to the operators panel, and what do you know - the system had gone READY  !

I went quite wobbly at the knees - I now desperately need to work out a safe sequence to start things up without causing loads of damage from my ignorance. It is complaining now of low hydraulic pressure - hardly surprising as the hydraulic pump isn't running. I know that the pump works as I've previously manually operated its relay to check its direction of rotation, but there must be some sequence to get the controller to start it.

I'm teetering on the brink of getting this beast doing things under its own steam

 

[spuddevans]

Woo Hooo!!!! 


Well done, I can't wait to see the video of it working 


Tim

[Pete.]

Teriffic news - I don't think I can go to work tonight now