Bandsaw Questions

[picclock]

Hi

I'm in the market for a Bandsaw. Usual 4x6 style. Apart from the usual dross I intend cutting some 5 1/2" pipe which I figure I can do by cutting halfway then rotating the pipe.

What does the term 'Mitre Arm' actually designate. I'm looking at a Warco catalogue which shows two bandsaws side by side. One is a Universal bandsaw and the other a Mitre Arm Universal Bandsaw. Look very similar. Cutting capacity is the same. The Mitre Arm version weighs 10Kgs more and costs £26 more than the other one. Ad says space saving but floor footprint is the same.

How important is the Motor power rating. I'm not in a production environment so speed (especially unattended speed) is not really an issue, although accuracy of cut could be.

I'm leaning towards http://www.amadeal.co.uk/acatalog/Bandsaw.html, but this does not have a vertical cutting facility, or wheels like the Warco Universal one. How useful would you rate the vertical cutting facility? Wheels I can bolt on. Capacity is about the same for the two machines although the Amadeal one has a 550W motor and is £25 cheaper (I think Warco will offer free delivery anyway).

Many Thanks

picclock

[jim]

i've got the Chester one, similar to the Amadeal one.http://www.chesteruk.net/store/h110_bandsaw.htm


excellent, for my needs.

i think the bi metal blades make a hell of a difference.

well worth the extra they cost.

i wouldn't recommend leaving it running unsupervised., just in case a blade jammed

the mitre arm, is its ability to cut angles.

band saws are another of them, once used, never be without tools!!

[JimM]

Hi Picclock

Think you'll find that the 'mitre arm' is just refering to the fact that the whole cutting part can swivel.

The space saving is gained in that if you want to cut at an angle the stock still goes into the vice in the standard position and the head swivels to the correct angle. On the standard saw the head is fixed and you swivel the vice, this means if you have a long piece of stock you need more clearance around the machine.  Hope that makes sense but if you want to come and have a look at my saw in more detail then you know where I am. (Mine's an Axminster swivel type)

Mine isn't listed as being vertical cutting but I just ground away part of the back casing to allow it to swing fully upright and knocked up a basic table from plywood which is good enough for me. There are plans for more advanced tables on the web.

HTH

Jim

[Lew_Merrick_PE]

Hey Picclock,

The issue of "mitre arm" or "swivel vise" is a personal choice issue.  Your best bet would be to find some gracious people with each type of saw and TRY making cuts on each to see which you prefer.  About 90% of cuts -I- make on my drop-bandsaw are straight cuts.  I have a set of 45° "inserts" that allow me to make that kind of mitre (raising the material vertically from the "outboard" end of the say) so I don't have to disturb my carefully set 90° set-up.

The thing about the "inexpensive" drop-type bandsaws is that: (A) the table of the saw is rarely flat, and (B) the pivots for the saw are rarely accurately set to a vertical 90°.  The first 4X6 (inch) drop-type bandsaw I ever got had been dropped and parts bent.  I had ASSUMED that the table not being flat, the index angle not being square, and the pivot arm not making a 90° sweep with respect to the table were artifacts of it having been dropped.  I have discovered in the interim that few (if any) of the "inexpensive" drop-type bandsaws are NOT in that condition.  (I have overhauled a couple dozen such units over the past decade or so.)  Fixing these problems pays off massively.  I usually bush the pivot arm holes while I have the mill set-up to dress that table flat.  About 1/3rd of the time I end up replacing the pivot arm for the saw body because it is neither straight nor true.

Finally, good blades are ESSENTIAL.  I am not sure about your side of the pond, but -I- only use Starrett and Lenox brand blades and I buy the fully-hardened blades with the "lubrication coating" on them.  It's cheap at twice the price!

[picclock]

Thanks for the info.

http://www.warco.co.uk/4-1-2--Universal-Bandsaw-3AF6510523.aspx
http://www.warco.co.uk/Mitre-Arm-Universal-Bandsaw-C737814DA1.aspx

Basically the main difference with the mitre arm one is that on one the head swivels at the base to facilitate and angled cut. I can live without angled cuts (well I hope I don't regret that statement  ). However right angle square cuts are very desirable.

Don't mind monkeying with the machine to get it to do what I want. Thanks for the info - just got to find one at the right price now.

Best Regards

picclock

[jiihoo]

Hi Picclock,

On the vertical cutting option: I don't have it on mine and occasionally I miss it. I'd also have taken the variable speed option if that had been available for a reasonable amount of money; this only matters if you frequently change from steel to aluminum and back, otherwise it probably don't matter much.

My saw is like the smaller Warco 3 1/2" but without the stand. I had a space limitation: either the saw can be pushed below the bottom shelf or I won't buy it, so I had to make a compromise. That set the limit to 1) less than 30 kgs and 2) no stand. Unfortunately that also meant no vertical mode, unless I get the inspiration to modify it. Mine will definitely get wheels on one end before I will even think about modding it for vertical mode, though, as that will add more to the ease of use...

Have you checked that you will be able to saw the 5 1/2" round pipe on it as that is quite a lot more than the 114 mm advertised round stock cutting capacity? Your idea of turning it after sawing the first half will probably work, but you also need to mod the vice to be able to hold it. As long as it fits in the opening of the arm it should be doable, though. We are an ingenious lot and we can make our tools do more than the manufacturer intended. Sometimes a lot more...

For all the beginners like me, the fastest way to saw flat aluminum stock on a vertical bandsaw is to fasten it vertically (short side up). Even if you have to turn it halfway through, this is faster than fastening it flat. When it is flat, the first 2 cm of the sawblade will do the cutting, after which there is no more space between the teeth and the sawblade will more or less ride on the swarf for the rest of the width of the material and progress will be slow. When the stock is vertical, the swarf will fly away and the blade will zip through the material.

I suppose all the experienced guys out there are laughing or at least smiling now, but I had to be told the previous when I started sawing 12 mm * 150 mm aluminum on mine. Laugh away, they say it is healthy for you.

[crabsign69]

in dont know muck about band saws but i di know this. get one with a sealed motor ive cooked two motors already the metal dust parts get in there and bam u get sparks and lots of smoke very annoying.  a completely sealed motor would be best  no more smoke show

[picclock]

I managed to pick up a used bandsaw from Warco. Its about 30 years old but apart from being knocked around and a bit rusty I don't think its had 30 years worth of work.

I bought it on the understanding that it was working and Warco 6 months parts only guarantee. So I got it home, fitted a plug, turned it on, - and all the lights went out - not a good sign   

The wiring connection cover on the motor had a dent in it, so I thought it must be touching the terminals. I removed the cover and found that there was a layer of insulating tape between the cover and the terminals. So my next thought was that perhaps the motor winding had shorted to earth and I started to disconnect it. At this point I looked at the wiring and stated to take pictures. This was an incredibly dangerous machine as it had been incorrectly wired. The machine body was not earthed, and one of the windings had been connected to the earth terminal.



After doing some measurements with a meter I surmised the correct connections (needed to sketch) and corrected it.



It was at this point I tried to join the 4x6 bandsaw group but my membership seems stuck at pending  . I wanted some confirmation that the wiring changes were correct.

I used an ancient 'meggar' to  check for grounding faults and satisfied that all was OK  and, with much trepidation, powered up the machine. Much to my relief (and surprise) it worked.

I then went on to check the worm drive which looked to be in perfect order, making me think that this saw had not seen much use.



Now all I have to do is straighten the tension adjusting tube (bent during some historic impact) and replace the blade. The cut is OK, I reckon 1mm off in the vertical over 5" and pretty much spot on for right angles.

So one last question for all you bandsaw experts - I want to use this for cutting steel, so what, if any, is the advantage of a variable pitch blade ? or would I be better off sticking with the common 14 (?) tpi one ? What is the best pitch of blade to use ?

Best Regards

picclock

[jim]

i'm shocked that a company such as Warco has sold a machine in such a dangerous state.

really shocked!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Jonny]

Certainly leaves a lot to be desired i am not surprised.

Both heads are the same in the link.
The rest is different, i have the Sealey painted one with QR vice. Its of no benefit unless going from large to small stuff! What i dont like is the wasted room with QR vice, meaning the least you could hold to saw would be in the region of 3" long then it would be iffy.

Been a long time since used mine in fact just got the bearings yesterday that packed up in no time 12 years ago.
I used to use the bi metal they are costlier but last longer especially the variable pitch.