collets question

[colin563]

i finally had time to try my mill today its taken me a while to get everything together

iv been making some t nuts

i was using mt2 collets and they seem to not hot the end mill very well

let let it drop down and that ruins my work

what would be the best collet system to go for on a morse taper 2 machine

ive looked on arcs site they do a er32 system would that be bettet

or should i go for end mill holders but  there doesnt to be the size selection that the er system has

just hoping for a bit of info before i spend my money

thanks colin

[sbwhart]

Colin

The good thing with the ER system is the range of things you can do with them with a few add ons, if you have a look her you will see what I mean

http://madmodder.net/index.php?topic=1998.0

You can build your kit up into something realy verstile.

Hope this helps

Stew

[Darren]

ER32,

Hands down, ER32 

[John Rudd]

I bought a Clarkson style collet set for milling....

Using cutters with a screwed shank prevents them moving axially which an ER set will not prevent....

If I've got this wrong then I'm sure someone will correct me...

[andyf]

Colin, are you using exactly the right size of collet for the cutter shank? There's no more than a very few thou  leeway on morse taper collets, so you can't close down (for example) a 1/4" collet (which is 6.3mm) onto a 6mm shank. And (forgive me if this is too elementary) you should be using a drawbar down through the spindle into the threaded hole at the back of the collet, to pull it up into the spindle taper, thus forcing it to close firmly on the shank it is holding.

The beauty of the ER collets which I have and which others have recommended is that each one will clamp down to 1mm under its nominal size, so you can use (say) a 13mm one to grip a 1/2" (12.7mm) cutter shank.

Andy

[sbwhart]

Johns correct about the screwed shank stopping the cutter turning, but I've never had a problem with my ER 32 system perhaps its because I don't push it too hard, I also use a diferent clamp nut the one I use as got a ball bearing head this gives you a greater clamping force on the cutter, I got it from Glostertooling I think they only sell via ebay I'll have a look and post the link.

Stew

[Darren]

I too don't find any problems with ER32, even with a 20mm cutter at an inch deep full width into steel.

If it don't slip then I guess it never will ....

[sbwhart]

OK you'll find the bearing collet nuts her page 21

http://www.glostertooling.co.uk/Download/Engineers%20tool%20catalogue.pdf

Cheers

Stew

[colin563]

thanks for the advice 

im going for the er32 system

ive just placed an order for the chuck 

just having a look for some collets now they are different prices everywere some exspensive 


thanks collin

[bogstandard]

Colin,

The difference in price between the same sized collets is that some are made to more exacting standards than others.

The ones we tend to use are the cheaper far eastern ones, but if you go for the more expensive more accurate industrial versions, you can spend way over the top.

I have found, like Stew above, Gloster Tooling do some very reasonably priced, slightly better quality than the norm. The normal way to buy from there is thru ebay.

http://stores.shop.ebay.co.uk/Gloster-Tooling_ER-Chucks-collets-wrenches_W0QQ_fsubZ8801468QQ_sidZ26428065QQ_trksidZp4634Q2ec0Q2em14?_pgn=1


I hope this helps


Bogs

[colin563]

i ve just won a ebay  auction for a set of 18 er32 collets

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=380170696272&ssPageName=ADME:B:BCA:GB:1123

but im going to have to wait for the chuck its from a hong kong ebayer

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170393213437&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBSA:GB:1123

hopefully that should be the spending for a while this hobby is bleeding me dry


cheers colin

[AdeV]

hopefully that should be the spending for a while this hobby is bleeding me dry

I feel your pain there... bought a mill for a bit over £1k, then spend another £5-600 on tooling (and even that's not enough, really), now £350 on a lathe...which comes with nearly no tooling (doh!).

I have a hungry racing car to feed too.....

Damn good job I don't have a SWMBO at present, although in fairness if I did have one she'd have kicked me out by now 

[jatt]

Damn good job I don't have a SWMBO at present

Definetely the best time to accumulate the essential items in life.

[bogstandard]

I feel your pain there... bought a mill for a bit over £1k, then spend another £5-600 on tooling

That is a bit of an understatement, and the trap most newbies fall into.

I was lucky and had most of mine either donated or heavily subsidised. Tooling can easily exceed the cost of the machinery.

I only buy tooling that I have a definite use for now and in the future.


Bogs

[AdeV]

I feel your pain there... bought a mill for a bit over £1k, then spend another £5-600 on tooling

That is a bit of an understatement, and the trap most newbies fall into.

I was lucky and had most of mine either donated or heavily subsidised. Tooling can easily exceed the cost of the machinery.

I only buy tooling that I have a definite use for now and in the future.


Bogs

I'm now at the stage of only buying low-cost 2nd hand tooling. I just won a whole stack of used 1/2", 5/8" and 3/4" end mills & slot drills - some scrappy, one with a very useful radiused end, all for just over 20 quid delivered (about £1 per end mill). There's a shop nearby where I can get plenty of 2nd hand tooling for similar prices (New Ferry Tools if you're based in Cheshire/Merseyside - well worth a visit, tell the owner that Adrian sent you if you go). Tomorrow I'll be there gathering up all the lathe cutting bits I can find...

Mind you, I did go a bit mad with some of the accessories.... 95 quid for a dividing head, 50 for a right-angle attachment (which I'll have to make my own collets for, as I only have a 1/4" one, and they seem to be made of unobtanium), 100 quid for a new vice. I still need (well, OK, want) a rotary table, but I'm wondering about making my own now; partially to save money & partially for the machining experience. Then there were the V-blocks, a set of metric & imperial cutters, metric collets, a drill chuck... you get the idea.

Why is there no "empty wallet" smiley? 

[AdeV]

Damn good job I don't have a SWMBO at present

Definetely the best time to accumulate the essential items in life.

You need to find a way of hanging onto them as well... ex-swmbo managed to separate me from a number of my Man Toys before I managed to escape...

[raynerd]

Rather than start a new topic, thought I would post my collet question in here. I have just seen an extra set of er32 collects I would like but they are advertised as:

Set of ER32 Collets Sizes= 3, 3-4, 4-5, 5-6, 6-7, 7-8, 9, 9-10, 11-12, 12-13, 16, 18, 19-20mm

I thought all the ER32 collets were labeled by range therefore any idea why there are there individual sizes named?

Chris

[andyf]

  Just a guess, Chris, but I believe imperial ER sets are available, especially in the US. Might it be one of those, with the imperial sizes roughly translated into their nearest whole mm metric equivalents?

[Jonny]

Andy 1/4" collets will close down below 6mm same as 10mm holding 3/8", not uncommon to reduce 1mm and clamp tight. Also 10mm will go in to a 3/8" but will need knocking in.

Been using MT2 on small mill for years best thing sinced sliced bread. Got full set metric and imperial and never ever had slip with collets from three different manufacturers most from Arc M10 and i put a cut on. This mill is belt driven i used to hold pulley with hand and tighten with spanner, nothing more. Grab pulley and loosen 1/4 a turn, tap it and out comes cutter all within a few seconds.
I have a fair few MT3 on bigger mill geared head. I made a plunger to lock in to splines whilst tightening and loosening. Similar to R8 and ive seen what they can do in one pass.

I think the problem will be lack of tightness and you would get the same with anything else including ER32 which take an eternity to change cutters, lose depth and exert additional loads on quill bearings.
May be better to borrow an MT2 taper cutting reamer and clean up spindle, i need to do this on my MT3 it locks solid.

[Jonny]

"Set of ER32 Collets Sizes= 3, 3-4, 4-5, 5-6, 6-7, 7-8, 9, 9-10, 11-12, 12-13, 16, 18, 19-20mm"

That is clamping sizes ie 3-4 will clamp round between 3 and 4mm like wise 19-20 is between 19mm and 20mm ala 3/4" cutters ok, same with MT (finger) collets 20mm will clamp 19mm.

[raynerd]

I`m just curious why he has labeled the set as such. He has put range sizes as I expect, eg. 3-4, 4-5, 5-6  but he has also listed a few as single numbers e.g 3  and 16 and 18. I wonder if they different makes of collet and he has listed what is wrote on the side? So basically, the 3 is actually 2-3 and the 16 is 15-16?

If that is the case then the set is:

2-3, 3-4, 4-5, 5-6, 6-7, 7-8, 8-9, 9-10, 11-12, 12-13, 15-16, 17-18, 19-20mm"

And is missing: 10-11, 13-14, 14-15, 16-17, 18-19

Chris

[bogstandard]

Like most things retail nowadays, he/she is most probably partially or fully illiterate, and stuck down what he/she thought was right.

A normal retail set will come with 18 collets, and half sizes and lower and higher ones are available individually.


Bogs