Author Topic: Mill Power feed (Read 77947 times)

sbwhart · « **Reply #50 on:** April 21, 2009, 07:15:41 AM »

That Shangie site also sells these would they be any good

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/2X-12V-200RPM-Gear-Box-Motors-for-Cars-Boats-Robots-New_W0QQitemZ180346950349QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_BOI_Industrial_Automation_Control_ET?hash=item180346950349&_trksid=p4634.c0.m14.l1262

Stew

Darren · « **Reply #51 on:** April 21, 2009, 07:52:03 AM »

I really don't know the answer to that, motors are not my thing really. But they look to be very small to me? Far smaller than a windscreen motor. Tiny in comparison.

I'll have to check what rpm mine is running at, 200 sounds a bit high to start with?

I paid a fiver for my windscreen motor.

Divided he ad · « **Reply #52 on:** April 21, 2009, 01:11:33 PM »

Darren, You're right, one handed opperation will have to be gotten around!

I was thinking possible belt drive? But that's all to be decided.... Need some time in my shop first!!

Stew.... Why would you want to buy those motors when I have a whole load here? With transformers and all sorts of circuitry! I'm sure they would run just fine at 12V too? 2-3 of these motors were never even fitted!!! They were out of boxes with parts missing!

It's up to you, I will get over there soon and bring a selection of bits with me.... I've still got 5 sets (motor and transformer) in my shop going for free.....
If it helps I could charge for them!!?? I remember the one about the free couch, 2 days, sign on it "free, just take it" and no takers, put £40 sign on it, stolen in 20 min's!!!

Quote

The one I linked is fine and easy to mount

Really!!
I'm going to have to scour the circuit boards for a rectifier too.... Knew there would be all sorts of fun bits I'd have to find for this idea!

I'm very impressed with the way yours works in the vid' Darren, It has inspired me to get it done and useable on my machine

Now.... To E-blag wars!!!!

Ralph.

Bernd · « **Reply #53 on:** April 21, 2009, 04:21:19 PM »

Darren,

Nice speed control of the motor there. Be interesting to see how you finish it off.

Bernd

websterz · « **Reply #54 on:** April 21, 2009, 04:38:29 PM »

I'm glad SOMEONE is having better luck with adding power feed. My mill flat out refuses to allow it to happen. My garage is a graveyard of useless motors, fried power supplies (added a new one to the pile today), and other assorted crap attesting to my many failures. I finally tossed the whole lot of other parts I had into the trash and am just going to keep cranking the #@$%^& handle.

bogstandard · « **Reply #55 on:** April 21, 2009, 05:29:28 PM »

Did I ever tell you about the THREE power feeds on my mill. It came with the X axis one in the package, and because I was a good boy and paid up front before taking delivery, they threw in the Y & Z axis feeds, fitted by them, as FREEBIES (plus a load more stuff and a rather large discount as well).
I did have to buy the power supply for the extra two though, that was a 40 squid 110volt site transformer. But I thought it was a rather good deal at the time.

I don't normally do it, but that is tool gloat.

I just couldn't help myself, as I knew you lot needed cheering up a bit.

Bogs

John Hill · « **Reply #56 on:** April 21, 2009, 05:41:35 PM »

Hmmmmmmmmmm..... something really odd happening here......

Bogs, is that not at least the third picture of that particular corner of your shop you have shown us, the corner beside the door where the fire extinguisher and the alarm panel are mounted?

bogstandard · « **Reply #57 on:** April 21, 2009, 05:57:40 PM »

Ah yes but, this is the first time I think you have seen the mill all by itself, showing it's THREE power feeds in all their glory. I can show you close ups if you are interested.

Oh, I forgot to add, even though not shown with the full layout on this shot, it now has FOUR axis DRO. X, Y and Z x 2. Plus of course, as we all should have, true variable speed from 0 to 2000 RPM, with FULL torque from the slowest to highest.

I'm now going very light headed, I am starting to feel like a true machine polisher.

Bogs

Darren · « **Reply #58 on:** April 21, 2009, 06:36:09 PM »

Yeah but, but, but....mine cost me a fiver......

Oh OK, I'd rather have yours.....

Darren · « **Reply #59 on:** April 21, 2009, 06:41:04 PM »

Quote from: websterz on April 21, 2009, 04:38:29 PM

I'm glad SOMEONE is having better luck with adding power feed. My mill flat out refuses to allow it to happen. My garage is a graveyard of useless motors, fried power supplies (added a new one to the pile today), and other assorted crap attesting to my many failures. I finally tossed the whole lot of other parts I had into the trash and am just going to keep cranking the #@$%^& handle.

What have you been using for the power supply and motors?

Darren · « **Reply #60 on:** April 21, 2009, 07:14:36 PM »

You know John, looking at that picture of your mill, I can't help thinking that it looks like it's gonna wake up and walk off.

Well, you did give it all that power, serves you right

Bernd · « **Reply #61 on:** April 21, 2009, 07:28:55 PM »

I was going to make a comment, but am afraid Bogs would "drive" that mill up were the sun never shines.

With all that power it would easy to do for him.

Bernd

bogstandard · « **Reply #62 on:** April 21, 2009, 07:56:55 PM »

It was just a bit of light hearted relief lads, everything was getting just too damned serious.

You see, everyone's got LOL's in their posts now.

Bogs

websterz · « **Reply #63 on:** April 21, 2009, 07:58:17 PM »

Quote from: Darren on April 21, 2009, 06:41:04 PM

Quote from: websterz on April 21, 2009, 04:38:29 PM
I'm glad SOMEONE is having better luck with adding power feed. My mill flat out refuses to allow it to happen. My garage is a graveyard of useless motors, fried power supplies (added a new one to the pile today), and other assorted crap attesting to my many failures. I finally tossed the whole lot of other parts I had into the trash and am just going to keep cranking the #@$%^& handle.

What have you been using for the power supply and motors?

I have a lovely 170 volt DC gearmotor that I cannot find a proper controller for. That thing has enough torque to twist your arm off...makes a nice paperweight. The motor I have been pinning my hopes on lately is from a 14.4 volt cordless drill. It is everything I need, plenty of torque, 0-600 RPM reversable, adjustable clutch, and small to boot. I can run it full bore using a 12v 6 amp battery charger and it does a fabulous job getting the table back and forth. The speed control is (was) built into the trigger, and it didn't have fine enough control. I broke down today and ordered this:

http://www.electronickits.com/kit/complete/motor/k166.htm

It eliminates the need for adding on a separate reversing switch, it uses a bi-directional pot for speed and direction control. One knob does it all.

I will add a 12 volt muffin fan to the enclosure to keep everything cool and use the battery charger for a dedicated power supply. It is wired for long duty use, fused, and has 3amp amd 6 amp ranges in both 6 and 12 volt. I should have plenty of speed range with it.

I can't give up on it now...that would not be very madmodder of me would it?

sbwhart · « **Reply #64 on:** April 22, 2009, 03:34:47 AM »

Quote from: Divided he ad on April 21, 2009, 01:11:33 PM

Stew.... Why would you want to buy those motors when I have a whole load here? With transformers and all sorts of circuitry! I'm sure they would run just fine at 12V too? 2-3 of these motors were never even fitted!!! They were out of boxes with parts missing!

It's up to you, I will get over there soon and bring a selection of bits with me.... I've still got 5 sets (motor and transformer) in my shop going for free.....

Hi Ralph I just posted those motors up for the Chaps who for distance reasons can't take up you're kind offer.

Thanks again

Hi Darren, Beleive it or not but I'm begining to understand whats required to do this job keep up the good posts.

Stew

Darren · « **Reply #65 on:** April 22, 2009, 05:06:05 PM »

That's good to know Stew,

You don't need to understand it now, but picking up a few bits will certainly help later when you have it all in front of you

Darren · « **Reply #66 on:** April 22, 2009, 05:25:49 PM »

Bit more on this tonight.....

Thinking about Ralphs predicament in only having one handle I decided to do some re-thinking. Besides I belive the whole set-up will be more stable with the changes I have made tonight.

I ditched the delrin coupler and turned a new one from alloy.
I wanted a good fit so I used my bore gauges for a change to size the bore as I was going along. In fact it turned out so exact than when I tried the freshly machined and still warm coupler on the shaft, the cold shaft cooled it and I had quite a job to get it off again !!!

This will be fixed to the mill shaft with an 8mm grub screw

Next I decided that I needed a mounting plate for the motor, I decided to use a piece of MDF for the mockup and see how it goes. This could then be the template for the real thing later.
Note the pointy spotters for marking the hole locations on the MDF

I didn't take any pic's of making the board, but you'll see it later.

Now I needed a way to mount the motor board to the mill. So off with the leadscrew bearing block, marked it up for drilling and tapping to 10mm.

Sometimes things just ain't big enough, so you have to improvise

A pair of tubes

Ends threaded to 10mm

Studs fitted to the leadscrew bearing block

And two tubes fitted.
Two inserts made with 6mm threaded ends

These slide inside the tubes and are a snug fit

Motor board fitted onto the sliders

Slide the motor onto the gear wheel to engage

Slide back to dis-engage

Simple pimple

And this nut stops it falling off, motor board slides to the nut when dis-engaged.

Another view

Darren · « **Reply #67 on:** April 22, 2009, 05:44:29 PM »

Some videos,
Hopefully these will show just how well this set-up works,

Ralph, the motor moves, not the motor shaft. The shaft is fixed to the mill. You can use the other end to make a fitting to fix a handwheel to and it will work fine..

And this is the finish, the line was my mistake, I stopped the feed halfway though for some reason only know to myself. Just wish I knew what the password was

The whole set-up is very rigid and secure. The idea is to fit a hand lever to move the motor and finish off with a proper cover to make it all nice and tidy.

Darren · « **Reply #68 on:** April 22, 2009, 06:09:35 PM »

I forgot to say, That piece of ally is 3.5" long, the mill took 22min to pass over it, so almost 6.5 min per inch....

That seems slow enough to me, but then I've nothing to compare it to?

Darren · « **Reply #69 on:** April 22, 2009, 07:07:08 PM »

Websterz,

I'm not sure I'd want to power a mill bed with a 170 DC motor, if something went wrong it's prob got enough power to do some real permanent damage.
Be better to have a motor with less power and have it stall or even burn out.

But, it would make a nice variable main motor, umm, now that would be nice.....send it to me, I'll make a power supply for it !!!

The drill motor is too fast, you won't be able to slow it down enough without it stalling unless you use gearing. Even the wiper motor is only just managing the real slow speeds. I have a feeling it would be better to gear it even though it is already geared. That way the motor speed can be doubled making it smoother running etc.
I'll see how it goes first though, others report they work fine and maybe I'm running it too slow anyway.

PS, you could build a power supply for that motor...

Bernd · « **Reply #70 on:** April 22, 2009, 08:09:00 PM »

Nice work Darren.

I'll bet you that MDF stays permanent.

Bernd

websterz · « **Reply #71 on:** April 22, 2009, 08:33:59 PM »

Quote from: Darren on April 22, 2009, 07:07:08 PM

Websterz,

I'm not sure I'd want to power a mill bed with a 170 DC motor, if something went wrong it's prob got enough power to do some real permanent damage.
Be better to have a motor with less power and have it stall or even burn out.

But, it would make a nice variable main motor, umm, now that would be nice.....send it to me, I'll make a power supply for it !!!

The drill motor is too fast, you won't be able to slow it down enough without it stalling unless you use gearing. Even the wiper motor is only just managing the real slow speeds. I have a feeling it would be better to gear it even though it is already geared. That way the motor speed can be doubled making it smoother running etc.
I'll see how it goes first though, others report they work fine and maybe I'm running it too slow anyway.

PS, you could build a power supply for that motor...

I tested the drill before disassembling it and my tach said I could sustain a low end of 20 RPM. With the finer feed control offered by the new controller I suspect that it will go at least that slow. If not I have a lovely selection of gears available. I can do as much as a 1:20 reduction just with what I have on hand.

hmmm...main drive motor eh...

Divided he ad · « **Reply #72 on:** April 22, 2009, 08:41:17 PM »

Nice work Darren

I've been a little busy thinking on this stuff myself tonight..... Came up with a slightly different approach, not even close to finished yet!

I have found some of these on the circuit boards though.... 4 to be exact.

Can you see them.... Black squares with the top right corner missing.... 4 legs and the little pictures on them like the flat square one you showed..... Stew, David.... we're sorted guys

This is where I'm upto in my "on the fly" design.... Just a few sketches on paper at the mo for the engage/disengage bit that Darren has sorted..... My motors are slightly different and mounting out of the back of the gear would be a bit harder (no spigot from the rear of the gears!)

Now this was marked out in true heath robinson stylee and I'm not apologising for it, it's functional and it works, it's just the way I do it

Clamp the mill bearing onto the plate, draw around it to show if it moves and drill the holes through the existing ones, once marked remove the bearing plate and re-fit to the mill, clamp up the marked plate and continue to drill and bore all the holes you need into the plate.... fitted like a glove!

New bolts to be purchased and a few bits to be cut away from the aluminium mounting plate (the bit with the squiggle on it) for the hand wheel to re-fit
That's it for now..... A (very) C-o-C of the intended design..... Sorry, it's late an I just scrawled it for you to see .

When the lever (far right) is moved to the right it will disengage the spline drive from the motor spline and pull the belt (might use a chain yet?) to the right by only 10mm or there about, not putting too much strain on the belt as it will be free wheeling on it's bearings when the hand wheel is rotated.

Right, I suppose I'd best get some sleep now ehh!!

Ralph.

Brass_Machine · « **Reply #73 on:** April 22, 2009, 08:48:28 PM »

I don't pay attention to a thread for 1 day and it explodes! Looking good there Darren. I am impressed.

Eric

bogstandard · « **Reply #74 on:** April 22, 2009, 09:05:58 PM »

Some very inovative cat skinning going on here. That is what it is all about, different methods ending up doing the same thing.

Well done to all.

Darren, I think your only problem is your flycutter shape and sharpening. The feed and speed you were going at should have had that ali plate like a sheet of polished chrome.

So a major good result for the feed, but could improve a bit on tool grinding. 9.5 out of 10.

Bogs

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Author Topic: Mill Power feed (Read 77947 times)

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