MadModder
Gallery, Projects and General => Project Logs => Topic started by: sbwhart on December 02, 2009, 06:16:33 AM
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Hi Chaps
At Model engineering exhibitions I've alway marveled at the models of radial aircraft engines, now this isn't going to be a petrol engine, but it going to be based on two design of model radial steam engines, I'm going to try and take what I think are the best parts in terms of good design and ease of manufacture from these two designs, plus a bit of bling so that they represent an aircraft engine (cooling fins on the cylinders)
The two design I'm going to work with are:-
The Cygnet Royal by Edgar T Westbury, I got my drawing free from Model Engineer but you can buy them from http://www.myhobbystore.com I understand that you can buy a set of castings for this design but I'm going to use bar stock.
Elmers Radial Engine drawings are available on John Tom http://www.john-tom.com/ElmersEngines/11_Radial.pdf
I've been planning this build for some time slowly putting my ideas together and doing a bit of research and I've started on a set of metric drawings as all my kit is metric, and to get round me the material and tools required.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2908.jpg)
I'm just short of some 2" dia ally but I've just ordered a 250mm length from ebay, the rest of the stuff came from my stash or as is the case of the chunk of sash weight cast iron from John, and the bearings were donated by Dave Bluchip
Thanks chaps :thumbup:
To make the boring bar for the crank case I copied out the sectioned drawing at a 1 - 1 scale and used this as a guide to grind the bar, and yes I know its the wrong way but I'm going to run the lathe in revers its easy to see what's going on that way.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2910.jpg)
This is it ground up
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2912.jpg)
Then with a chunk of ally in the lathe a start was made on the crank case, skim up the OD, centre drill then a series of drill, and then with a boring bar it was roughed out.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2914.jpg)
Well thats it every project begins and end on the lathe.
Have fun
Stew
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That sounds like a nice project Stew. Your little break project is probably larger than anything I've tackled so far! :poke: :lol:
Can't wait to watch this one unfold.
Nick
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This will be an interesting one to follow .... what's in your tailstock :scratch:
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This will be an interesting one to follow .... what's in your tailstock :scratch:
A cork out of a bottle of bubbly to keep the s**t out. :thumbup:
Stew
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what's in your tailstock
That's a rather personal question, doncha think?
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I really like radial engines...looking forward to your build!
Russ
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Radial engine fan meself. Watching this one!
Eric
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That looks a very interesting project Stew..... :thumbup:
Good luck! I`m watching, quietly..... :wave:
David D
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Well chaps here's some more.
Finished off the bore and then brought everything to finished size, Home made boring bar worked fine, although I had to trim a bit more off it to keep it clear of the job.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2915.jpg)
Now your going to love this bit.
Keeping the job in the chuck the whole lot was transfered to :----------------------------- wait for it wait for it:-----------------------------------------
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2916.jpg)
The indexer.
First job with a wobbler find the edges of the job:- zero the X on centre line and zero the Y on the front edge.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2917.jpg)
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2919.jpg)
With the fly cutter I then made the round bar into an hexagon, this is where the table stops paid for them self with the stops set I had no worries about running into the chuck.
Forget to take a pic of the fly cutting but you've seen that before.
Move the Y to where the cylinders will be mounted and zero the dro again from know on all features will be from the centre line of this hole.
Centre drill then roughing drill to get the meat out. Note use of support Jack
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2921.jpg)
And then with the boring head rough out all the to within 0.5 mm
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2924.jpg)
Thats it for today.
:beer:
Have fun
Stew
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Nice work! :thumbup:
[thinks] I really, really need to buy more toys! [/thinks]
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Nice work there Stew
Gerhard
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:poke: clock? :poke: :poke: wheel cutters :poke:
lol, looks like a good build. I`ll be watching!
:lol:
Chris
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Nice work! :thumbup:
[thinks] I really, really need to buy more toys! [/thinks]
Me too ............ :doh:
Looking good Stew.....looking good.... :clap:
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Very nice Stew.
Now you can see where I was coming from with interchangeable tooling, it saves hours in setup times. One chuck fits all.
John
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Stew, very nice. That indexer and interchangable chuck is going to be a godsend!
Nick
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looking good stew :thumbup: :clap:
chuck :wave:
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Nice! You don't half like a challenge!!!
looks like this retirement thing is going to be a lot of fun for you Stew :ddb:
Looking forward to seeing this unfold :thumbup:
Ralph.
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Well a bit more done today
With all the cylinder holes rouged out, brought the first one to size, then as I wanted all to be the same, it'll make things easy down line, the boring bar was clamp up and the other two finished at the same setting.
One of the reasons I've reproduced the drawing in cad was that I wanted all the holes dimensioned from the centre line of the cylinders this way I can make best use of the DRO, so to drill the holes move the table to the x and Y location drill the hole, rotate the spin indexer drill the same hole in the other face, spin index drill the same hole in the third face reposition the table x and Y etc etc
Like this
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2927.jpg)
And here we are with all the holes drilled in the horizontal position including the breather hole tapped 3/8*40 ME I'll tap the M3 holes on my tapping table.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2929.jpg)
I enjoyed that it took me just over an hour.
Have fun
Stew
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Stew,
The way you tackled that op looks very perfeshnial...... :thumbup:
David D
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Thanks guys
Got a bit more done this morning.
Took the chuck off the indexer and mounted it on the Rotary table, There was no real need to mount it on the rotary table but as I was planing to use the PCD feature of my DRO for the first time to drill a sequence of holes, I was edging my bets, and besides it would be easy to clamp and line things up with the RO.
Not much head space:-
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2934.jpg)
First job get one face of the Hex level with a DTI.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2932.jpg)
Next centre the bore with the centre line of the quill:- to do this you rotate the quill and manipulate the X and Y until you have zero clock movement
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2933.jpg)
Then set the parameters into the DRO:- Centre, PCD, number of holes, start and end angles.
Then all you do is set it at hole 1 move the x and y until both read zero your on position for hole 1 repeat for hole 2, et etc
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2936.jpg)
At first I just slightly marked each hole then checked that all was OK before centre drilling and then drilled for M3.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2942.jpg)
Then with the job still in the chuck back to the lathe for parting off.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2944.jpg)
I was really pleased just how easy that was with the DRO it really came into its own with that job.
:D :D :D :D :D
Cheers
Stew
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Very nice Stew, wish I had the confidence to tackle a project like this :clap:
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Not much head space:
:lol: I noticed that when I came round for the little visit!! That shop was built for one man.... And he's making little wonders in it! :ddb:
I really like the DRO's that you guys have, makes things much easier to do..... I think I'll have to wait a while for that though.... Either that of figure out how to make my shop pay :scratch:
Very good looking job so far Stew, nice to see it all taking shape :thumbup:
Ralph.
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Very nice Stew, wish I had the confidence to tackle a project like this :clap:
Darren with the great job your doing on your machinery you'll soon be knocking out some superb work.
This is the first real test I've given the DRO one of the reason I wanted to make a Radial is that they have lots a features to test the DRO on, you don't need a DRO to do all of this work but what it does is take the pain of dealing with back lash out of your machine so it makes thing a lot simpler.
Any way got a little bit more done:-
With the job parted off I set it up in the chuck to face it off to length, when disaster struck, the @£$%%^&* thing flipped out of the chuck putting a few dings in it, luckily they are in places that won't be seen when its all assembled together, so set it up in the mill vice to fly cut it off to length.
Now for the port face:-
A little bit more setting up required for this.
First as it will be easy to put features in the wrong orientation, I marked the job up where things were to go checking and double checking I'd got it correct, it wasn't accurately marked just enough to keep me on the straight and narrow.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2950.jpg)
Next get the job on the RT centre line, to do this you rotate the RT, as I was using a three jaw self centre chuck I had to keep channing the position of the job in the chuck and tightening up on different jaws to find the best place I got it to 0.1mm run out well fit for function.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2952.jpg)
Next I had to get the hexagon in the correct orientation by clocking up a face level with the RT on zero.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2951.jpg)
Then get the job on the centre line of the quill (spindle) to do this you hold the DTI in the spindle and rotate the spindle.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2956.jpg)
Then use the DRO drill the holes in this case one set of 6 and one set of 3.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2960.jpg)
At this point domestic duties were beginning to call so called it a day.
Cheers
Stew
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Nice work Stew, we're all getting DRO envy here. Lucky escape with the little mishap, it's a relief when that happens!
Nick
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Ok last bit of work on the crank case:- cut the steam galleries, the drawing calls for the angle from edge to edge to be 60 deg, but for machining the critical feature is centre to centre of the cutter I'm using a 2mm slot drill so drew it up in cad and checked the cutter centre to centre angle 44 deg.
The mill was still set on the centre of the job, move the radius distance to where the ports will be, and rotated the RT 30 deg then off set 1mm to allow 1/2 cutter dia. lower the cutter 1 mm into work and rotate RT 44 deg. To make things simple I worked out the movement of the RT in advance and wrote out a crib sheet.
Like this
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2970.jpg)
Ports cut
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2973.jpg)
Last job tap all the holes:- I used my home made tapping stand, so that they were all tapped nice and square.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2975.jpg)
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2978.jpg)
And there we are Crank case done.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2979.jpg)
Made a start on the cylinders I'm going to make these from ally with cast iron liners.
2" diameter length of ally being turned down.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2986.jpg)
I was hopping to get four cylinders out of this ally (one spare) but I forgot about the width of the parting tool so only got three, I'll have to be real carful
When making multiples its important to get certain key feature as near as posable all the same size, in this case its the width and the bore dia.
So by putting the job hard up against the back of the chuck and zeroing up the cross slide they were all faced off the same length.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2987.jpg)
Because of how I'm going to machine things down line I'm not particularly worried about getting the bore concentric with the OD. So sticking the blanks back in the chuck all the bores were centre drilled and drilled out with bigger and bigger drills.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2989.jpg)
They were all then rough out to within 1/2 mm of finish size with a boring bar.
Then finished off to size with the boring bar:- one after the other at the same setting, running the final cut through a couple of times to take the spring out of the bar.
For length they were all within 0.05mm and for dia 0.02 mm thats well fit for purpose.
Here they all are.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2992.jpg)
Next job the cast iron sleeves.
Have fun
Stew
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Stew
Starting to shape up nicely. I love watching those parts crawl out of a block of metal and take on a life of their own. :clap: :clap:
Cheers :beer:
Don
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Nice 1 Stew, starting to look like engine bits already!
Nick
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Very nice Stew, it is bringing back memories of making mine.
Mine was a lot more difficult, because it was a commercial castings kit that I used, and that was definitely a time it would have been better to do as you are doing, make it from bar stock. In fact it was the next set of castings that I used that put me off using them for life.
That is a bit of good advice for almost any thinking of making an engine from castings. A lot of the parts can be made from barstock much easier and cheaper, and only buy the castings that would be very difficult to produce.
John
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Geart work Stew :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
looks like allot of work in that crankcase ,,, i will not ask how big it is :doh:
I have allways fancey'd having ago at a raidal engine ,keep it up great read :thumbup:
Regards Rob
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I cant wait to hear it, intrigued as to what it will sound like. I always used to look at the cygnet package in Woking Precision Models catalogue when I was a teenager - it looked so simple in there but now I know better! :lol:
Nick
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Stew, a really smart and well written bit of machining! Even I understood it all..... well ok, most of it!
:clap: :thumbup: :clap: :thumbup:
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Nick It'll sound Prrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
John Built one a few years ago and he showed me a video of it running I can't remember where though :scratch:
Stew
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Mine sounded like a muffled ic engine, no vids left only a couple of piccies.
But Stews version will be different to mine as he is using a different cylinder setup, whereas mine was all integrally cast, Stew is using external porting tubes, which IMO will look a lot better.
John
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Having slept on it I decided to take some of the meat off the cylinders before I made the liners.
So first job turn up a mandrel thats a nice slide fit on the cylinders with a M12 thread.
Like this
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2994.jpg)
This required some quite heavy cuts and I was a bit concerned the liner would come lose, so decided to get rid of quite a bit of the unwanted material before fitting them.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2996.jpg)
Then turn down the 35 mm dia sash weight down to 19.25 to give a 0.02 mm interferance fit in the cylinder and part off to length.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2997.jpg)
Then set back up in the lathe, again concentricity with OD not that important, centre drill and with increasing in diameter drill rough all three out, then they were set back up to finish with boring bar at the same cut so they all ended up the same size.
As I'm going to use the mandrel again to finish off the machining its easyer if they all have the same size bore. The actual size of the bore is not that important, I'll just make the piston to fit, its easy to work to an accurate OD than it is a ID, what's important with the bore is that its parallel and the finish is reasonable.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_2998.jpg)
I just gave the liners a polish to give them a square start into the cylinder, then with a bit of high strength loctite they were squeezed together using the vice as a press.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3000.jpg)
And her we are all three liners assembled to the cylinders.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3003.jpg)
I give the loctite 24 hrs to cure before I do any more machining to the cylinders
Cheers
Stew
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Stew,
If you need it, I do have some very nice ali or brass tube that you can use for the transfer ports on the head.
Those cylinders do look very tasty. I have some of the fine cutters left over from the Halo cylinders if you want to do some finning.
Any problems with the very old cast iron?
John
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I do like the liner idea Stew :thumbup:
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Hi John
I was going to use some 1/8" copper tube for the ports but brass would match in nicly thank you.
I was going to ask for a loan of those thinning tools, and I was going to ask for a loan of those gang slitting saws to make a gang up to cut fins in the brass extention to the cylinder head I'm planning.
That old cast iron cut lovely. :thumbup: thank you.
Cheers
Stew
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No problems with any of that Stew, give me a call just before you come around, to make sure we are in.
John
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Stew, as always, taking shape really nicely. You make it look easy! :poke:
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Spent a bit of time today knocking the cylinders a bit more into shape. :hammer: :hammer: :hammer:
Set the mandrel back up in the lathe and turned it down to a nice fit on the sleaves, this is why I wanted all the bores the same size, so that one mandrell can be used for all three.
Then same trick as before:- chuck taken off the lathe with the mandrell still in place and fixed on the Spin Indexer.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3017.jpg)
Her we have one in the indexer with my crib sheet and two assy in the crank.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3018.jpg)
Close up of three in the crank case, I've got some more meat to take out and some holes to drill but I nearly made a couple of mistakes so decided to call it a day.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3020.jpg)
Just taken delivery of this from the US, I saw these in use a few years ago at one of our subcontractors, he was using a big one 6" dia to hone the bores of some hydrolic cylinders, have any of you guys ever used them and have you any tips.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3016.jpg)
Cheers
Stew
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Interesting Stew. That place is a few miles to the east of were I live.
I believe those are used more to take the glaze out of a bore than it is for honeing a perfect round hole. If the hole is egg shape to begin with this hone will not fix it. But if you have bored the hole perfectly round first then it will give you that cross hatch you are looking for in honing.
Your build has me leaning toward building a 3 cylinder engine as a next projcet. Keep up the good work.
Bernd
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Looking good Stew :thumbup:
The hone..... All I can think of to add is Lots and lots and lots of oil! Well that's what I was always told :thumbup:
Looking forward to seeing this taking shape :nrocks:
Ralph.
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Very impressed Stew .. looking forward to seeing the completed engine.
Quick question.. I've always left a gap for Loctite, never used it on things pressed together.
Can I ask why you used it on the cyl/liner asm?
So what's next ..
This one ??
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lycoming_R-7755
:)
Dave BC
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Hi Dave
It depends on the type of loctite and the application, I worked with loctite company for many years, and know some of their technical guys quite well, using high strength loctite with an interferance fit increases the strength of the joint considerable:- its the method BR use to fix the wheels on loco axles.
Cheers
Stew
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Tks Stew
Another urban myth I've been the victim of !!
Was once told there was no point in Loctiting (not sure if it is a verb) an interference fit.
Do one or the other. Still, if it's come from their folk, then I'll accept that. :thumbup:
At least until I'm smacked in the kisser by some errant BR rolling stock ... :D :D
Dave BC
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Dave,
It isn't an urban myth, but a fact, you only have to read the literature supplied with the product.
Loctite has thousands of different formulae that never reach market, it is devoloped for a customers personal sticky problems. When I worked in computer peripherals manufacture, the Loctite guy almost had a permanent home in the factory, they were making up special blends for us all the time, even ones that would work in the slightly reduced pressure of a cleanroom.
I too use normal Loctite in an interferrance or press fit, but I make sure at least one of the surfaces is slightly rough, to make sure that at least a little of the adhesive is carried into the joint.
If I want a real non come apart joint, but on metals that would be liable to distort if too much pressure is applied, I actually make the parts a tight sliding fit, then put a very fine straight knurl on the male part (not mine), then put the adhesive on before assembly. At a real push they can be got apart, but only after the Loctite is destroyed by heat, otherwise it is a joint for life.
John
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Interesting stuff guys.
put a very fine straight knurl on the male part (not mine)
now that would hurt! :lol:
Nick
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Loctite ??
No wish to wander :offtopic: gone to 'How Do I ??' for a new post
Dave BC
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Some more progress
Keeping the mandrell still in the chuck set it up on the mill and centred the mill quill on the mandrell zeroed the DRO.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3023.jpg)
Then just as with the crank case indexed and drilled the fixing holes for the cylinder.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3024.jpg)
With most of the key features machined in the cylinder time for a bit of bling.
Again still kepping the mandrell in the chuck it was transfered over to the lathe, then with one of Johns finning tools some fins were added to the cylinder.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3032.jpg)
I was going to use some 4mm brass tube for the air ways but the gap between the two pipes would only have been 0.75 mm so I bottled out of that and decided to use 1/8" copper tubes, did a lose assembly to see how the bling would look.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3035.jpg)
That doesn't look too bad, and I was realy pleased how the cylinders holes lined up with the crank case, this was all due to the accuracy I got out of the DRO, without out it I would have resorted to opening out the holes a fiddling arround to get things to assemble correctly.
Cheers
Stew
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That looks superb :clap:
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I can almost see the video :headbang: Great job so far!
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That is looking mighty nice :clap: :thumbup: :clap:
Tim
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That`s taking shape very nicely Stew! :thumbup:
David D
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Looks amazing Stew! keep it up... :clap:
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Very much liking the finning and the 2 tone look Stew :thumbup:
Looking forward to seeing the rest take shape :)
Ralph.
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Really nice that Stew, it looks fantastic. It's quite a size too, what is the bore and stroke?
Nick
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Hi Nick
5/8" bore * 1/2" stroke, Bothe the elmer design and the Royal have the same bore and stroke, the main diference between the two is that the Royal has a bigger crank case, and the con rods share a common axis.
Cheers
Stew
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Stew, thanks for that. Sounds like it might be pretty powerful and high revving. So it has some sort of rotary valve does it?
Nick
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Wow Stew... That is looking nice!
Eric
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Thanks for your kind comments Chaps.
Nick its got another prort face that sits over the galeries in the crank case these port faces are more critical to cut them I need a 2mm slot drill you then have a rotary slide valve that precesses around driven by the crank shaft, it'll be clearer when i show it all put together.
Any way on with the cylinder heads:- cut some 1/4" ally plate leaving 1mm big all round, and made some toolmaker buttons, the plates were threaded M6 and the buttons attached.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3039.jpg)
Then gripping onto the button a register was turned up a nice fit in the cylinders and the heads skimed off to 4mm thick.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3040.jpg)
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3041.jpg)
Then on parallels the button was clocked up to bring its centre line onto the quils centre line.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3042.jpg)
Then it was just a mater of using the DRO to find the position to drill the bolt holes, as I've shown before.
I want to fit a little brass boss on the head as a bit of bling, so first off ground up a radius form tool, I just took advantage of the rad that had worn on the edge of my off hand grinding wheel. Then using this form tool a nice rad was produced on a bit of brass this was then threaded M6 and parted off.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3043.jpg)
And screwed into the heads, this is how they look, a bit of tidying is still required but things are looking OK.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3047.jpg)
Cheers
Stew
-
Looking very impressive! Will it have a flywheel or prop? Or should I just wait and see? :lol:
-
nice looking engine stew :thumbup: ................can't wait to see a video (hint hint) of it running. :lol:
chuck :wave:
-
Thanks again Chaps
Nick its got a 2" dia fly wheel, not quite decided yet how to bling it if at all but I quite like composite fly wheels brass rim ally hub.
With regards to the valve movement, I've seen a pic of a Elmer radial that uses the same type of valve built with a perspex cover so you can see the action, I think it was built by Marv, if it was, he may be kind enough to post us the pic, if he reads this thread.
Cheers
Stew
-
I think this is the picture to which you refer, Stew...
(http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j234/mklotz/rotary.jpg)
The valve seals against the inside of the plastic so it's a bit tricky to lap the valve to just the right thickness to obtain that seal.
-
Thanks Marv
Much appreciated that perspex cover is a real cleaver way to demonstrate the valve movement.
Regards
Stew
-
Very nice Marv. These are deceptive, they look so simple from the outside!
Nick
-
Hi Chaps
Thanks again guys for your comments and interest
Had a right good do in the shed today.
First bit steam chest, turned out of a bit of 1 5/8" ally:- turn od then a big drill down the midle bore to size, transfer over still in chuck to the mill clock up OD to line up with quill and drill the holes on the PCD, the DRO realy does make this an easy job.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3050.jpg)
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3053.jpg)
Part off and face to length:- job done
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3054.jpg)
Next bit steam chest cover this is a bit more tricky as its not very thick:- turn up OD, turn step then with a trepan tool carve out the groove in the face.
Here we are trepanning
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3055.jpg)
Drill and tap 1/4" * 32 ME
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3059.jpg)
Over to the mill still in the chuck for drilling PCD
Back onto the lathe for partin off
Turn a threaded mandrel 1/4" * 32 ME.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3068.jpg)
And screw the cover on, then very gently small cuts and a sharp tool face it off to length and turn register step to fit in steam chest.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3064.jpg)
Thats another bit done.
Next up bearing housing:- Chunk of 2" ally skim up OD then turn up reduced diameter, the drawing calls for this to be tapered, but I'll need to chuck on the taper to do the other end:- forget it, I'll turn it parallel, if I decide I want it tapered I'll set it up on a lose mandrel when I've got the rest done.
First centre drill then bigger and bigger drills finishing up with a 3/4"
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3070.jpg)
Then with my favourite boring bar bore 7/8" for bearing.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3074.jpg)
Part off
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3075.jpg)
At that called it a day.
This is the steam chest and cover in place and the part finished bearing housing.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3076.jpg)
Have fun
Stew
-
This is coming together really fast - incredible work.
Chris
-
Really starting to look good there Stew. You've progressed quite fast on that build. :thumbup:
Can't wait to see and hear it run.
Bernd
-
Looks stunning Stew. Brilliant. Getting tool envy over your DRO, I've used them before and loved it, makes things a lot easier and the PCD feature looks really good.
Nick
-
Got a little bit more done this morning, the cold weather and family commitments have slow the build down a bit.
Finishing off the bearing housing:- I hadn't left enough flat surface for the screws to sit on so I needed to set the housing up on a lose mandrel to turn the dia down a bit so decided as I was already set up to taper the housing as the drawing.
Made a lose mandrel from a stub of steel faced off and tapped M8 with a cap screw with a big washer. You use a lose mandrel on jobs where getting things dead concentric is not important, the fit of the mandrel in the bore can be like a prick in a shirt sleeve to use the correct work shop term.
This is the mandrel
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3077.jpg)
Put the housing on lightly nip up the cap screw and clock it up tighten the cap screw check that nothings moved
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3078.jpg)
Machine away the bits you don't want.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3080.jpg)
I've bought some M3 stainless steel dome nuts that I think will look real well.
Cheers
Stew
-
That is looking stunning Stew, getting a nice look to it all round :clap:
-
Those stainless nuts finish it nicely!
Very nice work Stew.
Nick
-
That`s all coming together beautifully Stew! :thumbup:
David D
-
Great job Stew ,,stunning workmanship
Rob
-
Well this post is going to be a tail of Triumph over near Disaster.
Made a start on the crank shaft, drawing calls for a solid one piece crank shafts, all crank shafts I've made to date have been fabrication, but this being a one throw crank shaft I thought i'd make it in one as the drawing.
Ok first part using a 3" long bit of 32mm dia free cutting mild steel turn the main journal 3/8" dia.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3086.jpg)
Turn it round in the chuck and drill a 2.5 mm hole 2" deep for the oil way.
Centre drill then a jobber 2.75 mm then finish off with a 2.5 mm long series drill, drilling part way with an over size drill gives a bit of clearance for the swarf reducing the chances of it clogging and breaking, also keep clearing the drill back:- job done.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3098.jpg)
OK turning the offset for the crank.
Plan A :-
Mark off set with a small centre pop then with a pointed bar in the centre pop clock the bar up turn dia.
Marking out
Mark centre line and set centre line vertical
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3093.jpg)
Touch on top of bar
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3088.jpg)
Bit of maths
Mark position of off set
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3090.jpg)
Centre pop and her we have it in four jaw ready to be set up.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3101.jpg)
At this point tried getting it roughly set on the bench, and realized that with one jaw set over the next two jaws wouldn't close down, the diameter was too small.
Ok plan B. Make a bush with a 3/8 bore clamp the crank shaft with a grub screw positioned in a none important place (grub screw would mark the shaft) then I remembered that if you put a packing piece between the job and the chuck jaw you could get the off set, so decided thats what I would do.
Her we have the bush on the shaft with the packing piece.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3105.jpg)
And job part turned
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3107.jpg)
OK spotted the deliberate mistake.
:doh:
I'm using a three jaw, the geometry is all changed I used a 1/4" packing piece to get a 1/4" throw I should have used a bit of trig and worked out a thicker bit of packing or used a self centering four jaw.
A quick check and phew I still had enough meat left to get the job done.
Plan C:- well back to plan A really but using the sleeve to give more of a diameter to grip on.
Still had the off set marked with a centre pop on the bar end.
So her we are clocking it up
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3110.jpg)
And part cut:- interesting shape with the near mis not quite cleaned away.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3112.jpg)
1/4 dia turned and drilling the oil way.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3113.jpg)
Turned crank
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3118.jpg)
And in the housing
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3117.jpg)
Well that came out all right in the end I'm sure glad I did a quick check as to how the throw was coming out when I did.
Cheers
Stew
-
Stew,
Once again, you can say you`ve had a good day. :thumbup:
All`s well, that ends well........ :wave:
David D
-
Stew, you've already made a nice job of it, but if you ever do need to offset something in a 3-jaw, the formula is
Offset = 2/3 shim thickness. So, to get a 10mm offset you need a 15mm shim.
I didn't work it out for myself :smart:. It's explained towards the bottom of this page: http://homemetalshopclub.org/news/aug03/aug03.html
Andy
-
Thanks Andy :thumbup:
Thats filed away in my little black book.
Great link by the way.
Have fun
Stew
-
Stew,
Well done with that, you've done a great job there.
I thought about doing the same for the offset in the 3 jaw. I would have used 1/4" packing for 1/4" throw too - will have to look at Andy's link to find out why it's not!
I hate doing those, just hate the interupted cut - what size cuts did you take, did it take long? Maybe I had the speed too low.
I did it with a split bush on my rocking engine as remember the hassle I had using the 4 jaw on my stirling. But I drilled the offset hole in the bush in the milling machine and it must have wondered off because my crank disc wasn't uniform thickness.
Was the main dia. of the crankdisc part too thin to grip on in the 4 jaw?
Nick
-
Hi Nick
For plan A I used a 5/8" square HSS tool with a speed of about 350 rpm feed about 0.01mm and a cut of 0.5mm:- for plan C I used a tpmr TC tool same speed and feed but a cut of 0.75 mm, when doing jobs like that I just listen to the complaints from the machine when it looks and sounds happy I keep to that recipe, ( treat it like a woman ::)) I don't try and rush things, to turn the offset took me about 3 hrs with all the messing about.
Cheers
Stew
-
Cheers Stew, will bear this in mind next time!
-
Managed to steel a bit of time in the shop this morning and finish off the crank.
Blued the web up and set it up in the spin indexer, then by using my height gauge touching on the web then with a bit of calculation set the crank up so it was on centre line.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3119.jpg)
Then using the indexer and the height gauge marked out the web.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3122.jpg)
First bit of machining indexer rotated to bring the crank vertical and drill the oil way.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3124.jpg)
Then with a nice big milling cutter hack out the web shape.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3125.jpg)
Then mill the flats to drive the valve crank. By rotating the indexer 180 the flats came out nice and symetrical on the crank.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3128.jpg)
A quick debur and thats it done just need to plug the oil ways up.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3136.jpg)
Cheers
Stew
-
Nice crank there Stew. That spin indexer has come in handy. I was showing one of the apprentices here some of your indexer pics a couple of days ago to explain some of his college homework!
Nick
-
Nick
I'm pleased that my pics were used to help a young chap with his education.
Got the fly wheel completed, the drawing calls for a cast iron flywheel but I'd got some suitable brass and I also like making composite brass ally fly wheels.
So first job make the hub I'd got a bit of ally the correct diameter but it was a bit on the thin side to chuck and part off, so I put a hole down the middle of it and held it on a loose mandrel to turn up the OD.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3085.jpg)
Then stuck it into the middle of this chunk of brass, I found quite a few bits like this down the scrap yard.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3141.jpg)
The fly wheel is held on the crank using a split tapered collet. so to make the collet, swing the compound over to 5 deg (10deg inclusive) and turn the taper, then put a 3/8" dia drill down the middle, and part off.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3140.jpg)
Then don't move the compound, keep it set.
Chuck up the fly wheel, flip the boring bar upside down, and working at the back, bore the taper in the hub, because nothings bin moved the tapers will match perfectly.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3142.jpg)
Skim up the OD of the fly wheel part off and face the other end.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3143.jpg)
Split the tapered collet and her are all the bits for the fly wheel completed.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3149.jpg)
This is how it looks
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3144.jpg)
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3147.jpg)
Thats all the outside bits of the engine done just the innerds to do now.
I guess thats all until after Christmas
So I'd like to wish you all and your families a very merry Christmas.
Have fun
Stew
-
Stew,
That engine`s looks improve almost every time I log on! :clap:
Here`s wishing a Very Merry Christmas, to you & yours. :thumbup:
David D
-
That look great Stew :bugeye: :thumbup:
Gonna be good to see it running :)
Hoping you have a great Xmas season....
I'm just planning to spend time in the 'shop! I've a whole week and a bit off...... Got to try to do something!
Take it easy,
Ralph :beer:
-
Looking real good Stew.
I like your split collar method of attaching the flywheel. But the upside down boring bar makes my stomach a bit queezy. :lol:
And a Merry Christmas to your too.
Hey Ralph, you ever going to finish your Aeolipile? (sp?) :D Ya, I know :offtopic:
Bernd
-
That's excellent Stew. I like that method of fastening a flywheel. in fact I was going to try it on my engine last night with a lighter flywheel. Engine is looking great.
Merry Christmas to all.
Nick
-
Happy new year Chaps
I bet you thought I'd given up on this. Spent new year St Ives a Cornish fishing village/town, made a complete fool of myself by joining in the fancy dress party that the town holds, got a little bit tipsy dressed as a red indian (must have been the fire water).
Any way on with the build:- con rods.
First job draw the rods out in cad and dimension the key features from the centre line of the big end bearing, then cut some plate to size, for the rods important to get all the bits the same size as it will help help in doing all three with the same set up.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3158.jpg)
Then set up in the mill bringing the vice stop into play then drill big end zero the DRO in X and Y and then drill other holes, repeat, repeat.
Her we have them all drilled.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3162.jpg)
Put a couple of same size rods through the web holes sit them on to a couple of parallels, tighten up the vice remove rods and parallels.
and chew out the meat.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3164.jpg)
Fit the big ends with 1/4" phosphor bronze bushes, the little ends are also drilled 1/4" (that I will bush later) and make a 1/4" mandrel, one mandrel will do both ends.
Then fix on mandrel and thin the webs.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3167.jpg)
Flip over and locate on the other end and thin the other side.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3168.jpg)
Then with the mandrel held in a collet on the rotary table round the ends off.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3174.jpg)
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3177.jpg)
There we are done they just need a tickle with a file to tidy up.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3178.jpg)
The centre con rod is at the back in this pic with the two off set rods in the fore ground.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3183.jpg)
Have fun
Stew
-
Nicely done and shown Stew...... As usual! :thumbup:
And a Happy New Year to you and yours! :wave:
David D
-
Wow, :bugeye:
You did those con rods so well I've just thought of a genius nick name for you - Rod Stewart! :lol: :doh: never mind!
Seriously, they are really impressive, everything seems churned from the solid on this! Looking good.
Nick
-
Nice job on the rods Stewart :lol:
-
Made a start on the pistons over the last couple of days. The first thing I did was to hone the cylinders sp that I would have a final size to work with, I used a flexie hone with plenty of oil, I didn't go over board with the honing just a quick lick up and down for about 10 seconds, but it was enough to produce a nice smooth bore.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3186.jpg)
Then used this new toy to give the cylinders a good clean, its a lidle ultrasonic cleaner on offer for £20:- Great for cleaning glasses and false teeth, wanted to try it out on Mother in-laws teeth, but the miserable old bugger wouldn't let me.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3187.jpg)
Then I carefully measure the bores they were all within 0.02 mm and kept a not with each one of their size.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3188.jpg)
The turned down a chunk a window sash weight and drilled and bored the ID.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3189.jpg)
Then I wanted to try out my home made tool post grinder to get a nice finish on the OD of the cylinder, it took me a good bit of time and a lot of 13 amp fuzes (don't ask :zap:) to wire up the new toggle switch I'd bought for it.
But it worked a treat got a nice finish on the cast iron and a nice fit.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3191.jpg)
This is two ground up and just sitting nicely in the bore, the third is still on the bar waiting to be parted off:- thats a job for another day
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3194.jpg)
Have fun
Stew
-
Stew,
Looking great, I bet with that flexi hone and grinder you have got an amazing fit there. Very nice. That ultrasonic cleaner is a bit posh too, did it work well?
Nick
-
Thanks Nick
The ultrasonic cleaner worked great, you can use plain tap water or add a few drops of washing up liquid for real dirty bits. They can be too good caused a lot of problems with fuzes the parts were too clean to function, ended up adding a small amount of oil to the liquid to put a bit of slip back in the system.
Have fun
Stew
-
Very nice Stew :thumbup: looking great :clap: :clap: :clap:
Regards Rob
-
Stew, do you think the ultrasonic cleaner would be good enough to clean up old watch and clock movement parts? I know you can pay hundreds for them and appreciate they probably wouldn`t compete with those but do you think they would do something or at least worth the £20 you paid for that sort of thing?
Chris
-
Hi Chris
I think it would be OK for watch and clock parts, although I wouldn't recommend using it on an expensive watch, it comes supplied with a basket that keeps the movement clear of the liquid whilst you clean the steel bracelet in fact I used it to clean the bracelet of my watch, it did a good job. I got it from Lidles who currently have them on offer, so far I'm happy with it.
Hope this helps
Stew
-
Looking good Stew!!
-
Hi Chaps
The cold snap we're having in the UK as kept me out of the shed for the last couple of days, so instead of freezing my nuts off maching, I've been in the warm drawing up the engine. So this post is by way of an experiment, I've attached one of the drawings as a PDF file, a bit of fead back as to how it opens and reads would be apreciated, I've just got the assy sht to do, so as long as I'm not breaking any copyright I'll add the drawings as a down load.
Cheers
Stew
-
Well just tried opening the PDF some of the lines seem a bit heavy, lets see how the feed back goes.
Stew
-
downloaded ok, had to expand it quite a bit to read everything (as you say abit heavy on the lines) :thumbup:
-
Like wot Jim says...... :thumbup:
It`s sideways. Got a crick in me neck now! ::) :D
-
Yeah don't know if it's the lines or resolution, at 100% it looks alright but too small to read :lol: So when you zoom in the lines get too thick. Looks good though :thumbup:
Nick
-
Thanks for feed back chaps:- had another try is this any better.
Stew
-
That looks better :thumbup: what do you think.
Stew
-
That looks better :thumbup: what do you think.
Stew
I think that`s spot on! :thumbup:
Nice & clear at 85% on my laptop. Well done Stew! :clap:
David D
-
Perfect Stew, :clap:
What prog did you use to draw it?
-
Parat cad ::)
Stew
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Hi Stew, your link to the drawings would not open for me...indeed I am having some problems at the moment using the site...could be ''Snow'' on the lines. :bang:
John.
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Perfect for me Stew :thumbup:
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Not so cold today so got the pistons finished.
Set up for drilling gudgiun hole. find edges and index to corect position, all three were drilled from the same setting
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3196.jpg)
The inside of the piston requires milling out to give clearance for the con rod little end.
This is the set up, a length of 4mm rod was inserted in gudgion pin hole then squares this up to the vice,
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3197.jpg)
At my first attemp I used a 3mm slot drill but broke it so went up the a 4.5 end mill that worked ok
And her they are done
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3200.jpg)
And on the crank
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3198.jpg)
I've just got three bits to make before I start assy and test, so I've attached the drawing that shows these last three bits
Have fun
Stew
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Looking spot on those ground pistons! :bow:
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Looking good Stew.
You won't be able to upload the file. Admin has removed the "download" section for now. It's not working properly. I believe he's working on it. Give it some time.
Bernd
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Thanks Chaps
Bernd thanks for the download info.
A good afternoons work today making the return crank, this is a tricky little beast, I've had a good head scratch over it :scratch: all the drawing show it as one piece, however I think it will be easyer to make as two pieces and still function correctly.
The drive pin is positioned relative to the drive slots and its position times the engine, you can get the position with a rotary table or you can use cordinates from the centre line, I've dimensioned the drawing so you can use either method.
OK first job chunk of 30mm free cutting mild steel in the lathe turn down to 1" and put a small centre in the end,
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3202.jpg)
Keeping the job in the chuck transfer the chuck over to the mill with a centre in the quill wind it down tight into the centre in the end of the job, clamp the chuck to the table, Zero your dials or DRO, You've now got your centre datum.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3204.jpg)
Then mill the face up to get rid of the centre its done its job and it will only get in the way down line, mill flats and then mill drive slot 3/16"
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3206.jpg)
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3207.jpg)
Then to accuratly locate the drive pin move to drawing cordinates.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3211.jpg)
Centre drill then drill with a number drill to give a tight fit on 1/8" silver steel, spot of loctite and press pin in using mill head.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3213.jpg)
Transfer over to lathe turn diameter and part off,
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3216.jpg)
Face up the back, and thats the beast tamed.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3222.jpg)
and this is where it fits on the crank
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3228.jpg)
Have fun
Stew
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That part looks a nightmare to do! Well done Stew, 1 down 2 to go? It's going to be a powerhouse of an engine this one!
Nick
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Loving this. Radials and v-twins for me please..
Nice. :bow:
Eric
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Machining of the return crank was superb! I learn a lot from reading your detailed posts.... please keep them coming :clap: :clap: :clap:
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Nick,Eric,Chris
Thanks for your kind feed back
Cheers
Stew
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Nice job Stew
This one is coming on great
Gerhard
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Even if I don`t attempt this for years, still tons to be learned from the build!
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Gerhard/Reflection
Thanks for your intersts and positive comments.
Shop time over the last couple of days has been a bit restricted by other commitments. Any way managed to get a few hours in and complete the port flange. By way of a off topic but related bit of kit I took delivery of an coax indicator, I got it from amadeal on ebay www.amadeal.co.uk at £44 + post it was the best price I could find in the UK.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3250.jpg)
Its quite a long bit of kit and I was strugling with head room what with my rotary table and collet chuck adding to the height, then I remembered a tip from a friend that I could use M3 collets this would give me an additional 3" of room to play with. The coax has a 10mm shank but my collet set is imperial so i made a split collar to use with a 1/2" collet (note to self get a metric set of M3 collets).
So her we are
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3253.jpg)
And this is how you use it.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3251.jpg)
With a stylus in the bore (or OD) and the outrigger stopped with a magnetic stand, this is to stop it whizzing round and to keep the dial facing you. Run the mill at about 200 rpm, adjust one direction to a point where you get the least dial movement, do the same in the other direction, repeat again, repeat again, after three interation you should end up with zero movement, and thats it you're on centre line, a lot easyer and quicker than having to crane your neck with a dti.
Back to the port flange, for my first attemp I used a bit of scrap yard alluminium phospher bronze, but this material was up to its usual tricks and was a bitch to machine, I don't know now why I tried it. Made onother from a nice bit of free cutting brass, this is a straight forward turning job so no pics.
Now for another bit of off topic but related. The ports are 2mm wide and I don't have a 2mm diameter cutter, cutters this size cost an arm and a leg, and I can't see me using this size very much, but I remember reading that in the "good old days" people would use a D bits to cut the steam ports for model loco, so I set too and made some 2mm dia D bits.
Truning the dia
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3235.jpg)
Sectioning to 1.1 mm:- 0.1 above centre
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3243.jpg)
I blacked the cutter up so I could see what I was doing then with a fine file and under a magnifying glass I backed the cutter off.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3245.jpg)
Heated them up to cherry red and quenched in water, then gave them a rub on a stone to sharpen the edges up, and her we are done.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3249.jpg)
To machine out the ports I decided to use the PCD function on the DRO combined with the movement of the rotary table.
Centre the job up using the Coax indicator.
Set Rotary table on zero deg
Set PCD function to drill 8 BA clearance for the clamp screws and drill.
Then set PCD function for port position, drill 1.8 mm hole in each port position using DRO.
Rotate RT +13.5 deg use DRO to drill 1.8 mm at each port position
Return RT to zero then back -13.5 deg use DRO the drill 1.8mm at each port position.
Her we are with all the holes drilled
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3255.jpg)
Then using the little D bit join the holes up by rotating RT 27 deg.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3258.jpg)
Thats it job done, her it is in position. The D bits worked great them milled a nice accurate 2mm wide slot.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3261.jpg)
I've completed the assembly drawing for the engine so I've attached it to this thread.
Have fun
Stew
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I can almst hear you blipping the throttle Stew :clap: :clap: :clap:
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Thanks Powder Keg
Got the Orbital Valve machined up, you have to get the thickness of the valve a very accurate fit in the valve chest, so first thing I did was to measure everything up, to determine what thickness it needed to be. Turned up a chunk of cast iron, transfered it over to the mill still in the chuck, well by now you should know the routine, drilled 6 * 1/8" holes, then back onto the lathe to finish off, the under cut face
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3263.jpg)
Parted it off then pushed it hard up against a parallel in the chuck (don't forget to remove the parallel) then faced it off to thickness + 0.20 for lapping each side, and undercut the face.
And her it is in place, you can see the open valve port on the left the other ports are closed off.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3267.jpg)
At this point I thought thats it all the maching done, but no I've forgotten the stand.
Have fun
Stew
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That is an unusual valve. Too bad some of this stuff is hidden when it's put togather.
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Wow, nice work Stew, some great tips in there too. I am definitely going to have to try this D bit thing!
Nick
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Hi Stew
as Nick said , great thread and alot of good info , thanks for sharing
Regards Rob
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Wes/Nick/Rob
Thanks for your nice comments and support.
Got some work done on the stand, had a sort through my stash and came up with these bits.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3269.jpg)
I had a square of black plastic that I was planning to use for the base but it was a bit on the thin side and the proportions didn't look like, that chunk of wood looks a bit thick as well :scratch:
Any way made a start on the upright I'm using a bit of ally ingot, its nearly a pyramid, cleaning up the sides.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3273.jpg)
It was getting a bit difficult to clamp so tilted the head of the mill.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3275.jpg)
Found a thinner bit of hard wood under the bench that's is a bit thinner. don,t know what sort of wood it is, its a nice gingery red.
Squared up the edges in the mill and used a radius cutter to sculpt the edges.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3277.jpg)
And thats what its going to look like, I need to get some sand paper to clean it up a bit more but it looks OK.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3278.jpg)
Made a start on tidying things up and assembly, I,m not a great one for making things too shiny, its just a personal thing, I like them to display honesty and bare witness as to how they were made.
Have fun
Stew
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Stew,
That's a real nice looking stand you made there. It definatly fits the engine.
Bernd
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Thanks Bernd, the wood machined up real nice concidering I was using milling cutters for steel on it.
Bit of a short update:- started assembly work, but soon realised that I'd forgotten to mill the 10 deg air pasage in the cylinder, decided the best way would be to use my 2 1/2" sine bar, her it is set up with the corect packing.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3280.jpg)
And this is how it was used to
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3281.jpg)
Want to try gaskets made from brown paper stuck down with grease, these are the gaskets ready for use, with the tools of the trade.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3283.jpg)
Spent a fair bit of time makeing and fitting studs and putting the air pipes in the cylinders and giving thinga bit of a tidy up, tried assembling things losely together it all seems to fit.
And this is all the parts exploded appart.
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/100_3291.jpg)
If I can get the chance I'll start final assembly this afternoon and a trial run, fingers crossed.
Have fun
Stew
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That`s looking really businesslike Stew! :thumbup:
Good luck with the first trial run......
David D
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Dave thanks for the good wishes.
Didn't get the assy finished today just got a few studs to make and a hole to drill in the base, started to get tired, thirsty, and cold, so called it a day.
I don't know what you lads think but you don't really start to under stand an engine until you assy it and try to get it to run. I decided to fit the bearing housing to the crank case with studs and dome nuts it would have been easyer to use cap screws, the studs meant I had to line them up and at the same time get the crank lined up with the big ends in the con rod and the return crank, I havn't fiddled around so much since the first night of my honeymoon. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Any way couldn't resist trying out on the base to see what it looked like, so here's a taster:-
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/100_3297.jpg)
Don't half look OK don't it ?
:D :D :D :D :D
Stew
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To quote a "Scrapheap Challenge" contestant.......
"Proper Job" :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
Looking real good there :clap: :clap:
Tim
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That is a beauty Stew. :bow: :clap: Anticipating the video.
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That is really nice work Stew and I am sure it will be bursting into life real time soon! :thumbup:
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Don't half look OK don't it ?
:D :D :D :D :D
Stew
That looks VERY ok Stew! :thumbup:
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Nice 1 Stew, can't wait to see it running. Wish I could hear it though, videos don't tend to do these things justice!
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Well got it running its a bit slugish I think my compresor is short of wind, not a lot of action to see realy stuck a bit of sticky tape on the flywheel so you could see it was going round, my untidy shop is probably more interesting.
:D :D :D :D :D :D :) :) :) :)
Going to take it arround to a friends to try it on a bigger compressor and try a tacko on it
A happy Stew
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:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
Stew, I'm consumed with envy; nothing I make ever works first time (or in some cases, ever) :(
Congratulations!
Andy
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Stew,
That looks like a pretty good runner there. Nice job. :thumbup: :clap: :thumbup: :clap:
If you need a bit more wind, might sugest a couple of cans of beans. That should help out. :lol:
Ya, I know, bad idea. :hammer:
But still a runner first time around, that deserves acouple of :ddb: :ddb: :ddb: :ddb:
Bernd
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Sluggish?? ....... Sluggish?? :scratch:
There`s nowt sluggish about that, lad! :bugeye:
That`s a cracker! Blummin well done! :clap: :clap:
VERY pleased for you Stew! :thumbup:
David D
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That is a sweet runner. :beer: :clap:
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Stew
Great little engine .. I love it :bow: speed is OK, I reckon 1500 rpm or so ...
Still not worked out how the valve works tho ::)
Must be fixed to the crank ? Probably somewhere in your epic thread ..
PS Should it not be Tri Pot-ttyengineering ? :)
Dave BC
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Hi Chaps thanks very much for your comments.
John breathed a bit of extra life into it, I'd got too much clearance in the orbital valve in the team chest, it really speeds along now tacho reading 2200 RPM at max air pressure and it throttles down to just a whisper.
I've got some vids that I'll edit and post over the weekend.
Thanks again
Stew
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Top notch work Stew :bow:
Looks great and turns over well enough.....
John breathed a bit of extra life into it,
He's good at doing that :thumbup:
Waiting to see the new vid(s), will be nice to see it run through a range of speeds :)
Ralph.
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Nice one Stew :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
Very cool engine :thumbup:
Regards Rob
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Rob/Ralph
Thanks very much for your kind comments
Ralph:- John was just as chuffed as I was to see the engine running he spotted straight away how to tweak it to get an improvement.
Her's a posh pic for the album
(http://i431.photobucket.com/albums/qq32/sbwhart/Rotary%203%20cylinder%20steam%20engine/IMG_2029.jpg)
And the promised edited Vid
Its been a really enjoyable engine to build, I hope you guys have enjoyed the journey as much as I have.
I've brought the drawings up to date and frozen them by changing the text from red to black, and attached them to this post
Have fun
Stew
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Stew,
Blummin well done! :clap: :clap:
Thank you for showing! :thumbup:
David D
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Well done Stew, that's a really nice looking engine :clap: :clap:
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Very very nice Stew! You rock for doing the drawings as well! :bow:
:mmr:
Eric
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Hi Stew
You must be chuffed at the way the engine has turnned out , looks oustanding in the " POSH photo " , Great post :clap: :clap: , and thanks for sharing the drawings , a must to build
Cheers Rob
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Nice build stew i see the old smiths mechanical tachos get around dont they :clap: :clap:
Cheers Paul
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Stew nice job on the engine and thanks for the plans. I just sent you a PM btw..
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Hi Guys
I'd like to thank you all for your real nice comments. :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
As I said it was a real enjoyable project, in fact its knocked my plan to get on with my loco build of target a bit, it was the redesign work with the loco lubricator and water pump that prompted me to make the three cylinder, it reminded me how much I enjoy design and development work. So I've got a bit of shop maintenance work to do and a bit of tooling to make, and I want to finish off a part finished elbow engine to raise a bit of shop cash, then I'm seriously considering doing another small engine build, I've seen a small Grasshopper Engine at the Manchester Museum of Science and Industry that's just crying out to be modeled.
I've attached a pdf file thats got all four drawing sheets on one file.
Thanks again
Stew
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Good going Stew :thumbup:
Looks and sounds really good :bow: Might get to see it in person one day?
I'm seriously considering doing another small engine build, I've seen a small Grasshopper Engine at the Manchester Museum of Science and Industry that's just crying out to be modelled.
Won't be long before you need to buy/build a new display case for all your engines. :)
Ralph.
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Any time your over Ralph
:headbang: :headbang: :headbang: :headbang:
Stew
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Well done Stew, that runs fantastically and sounds brilliant! These little engines are so satisfying to build and watch and there are enough designs for a lifetime!
Nick
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Thanks Nick
I emailed Manchester Museum of Science and Industry yesterday on the off chance that they had drawing or info on the Grasshopper, got an email back today to say that they havn't but have have cleared it with the curator for me to go over and to measure it up.
:ddb: :ddb: :ddb: :ddb: :ddb:
All I've got to do now is to convince my boss thats she wants a days shopping in Manchester, and by the way I'll keep myself buzzy in the science museum.
:) :) :) :)
Have fun
Stew
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Stew,
Sounds interesting, it would be nice to build something from scratch like that. I've got the railway museum in Shildon a couple of miles from me and often think of doing that. Wouldn't know how to go about it though!
Nick