Author Topic: Machining AlNiCo  (Read 7073 times)

Offline S. Heslop

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Machining AlNiCo
« on: June 21, 2013, 09:02:58 AM »
I've bought a pack of 10 alnico polepiece magnets for electric guitar pickups (but in this case i'm trying to make an electric banjo). Being the clever sod I am I bought them oversized figuring I could easily machine them to length.

The magnets came with a wee magnet safety pamphlet that said that they were difficult to machine without specialist tooling. I've had a look through google and haven't been able to find anything beyond various companie saying 'yes we can machine it' in the sales pitch.

I'm just wondering if anyone's had any experience with this. 10 magnets are exactly the amount I need so I don't want to try experimenting. I suppose there's also the concern with toxicty if it gets all dusty while machined.

Offline NeoTech

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Re: Machining AlNiCo
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2013, 11:55:11 AM »
I have tried to machine magnets of varying type.. And sorry to say if you dont have access to diamond cutting tools and a  high pressure flood cooler those will not be cut with quality. I tried HSS, indexed tools of varying quality and well they have tendency to explode and not taking vibrations well.. Sintered little buggers..
Machinery: Optimum D320x920, Optimum BF20L, Aciera F3. -- I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work. http://www.roughedge.se/blogg/

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Machining AlNiCo
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2013, 02:05:04 PM »
I have tried to machine magnets of varying type.. And sorry to say if you dont have access to diamond cutting tools and a  high pressure flood cooler those will not be cut with quality. I tried HSS, indexed tools of varying quality and well they have tendency to explode and not taking vibrations well.. Sintered little buggers..

That's a shame. I've got one of those diamond tile saws hanging around somewhere. Would there be any hope of grinding them to length with that?

Offline Swarfing

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Re: Machining AlNiCo
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2013, 02:16:16 PM »
How about a bench tile saw with diamond blade?
Once in hole stop digging.

Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Machining AlNiCo
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2013, 02:30:54 PM »
How about a bench tile saw with diamond blade?

That's a good idea.

I've got one but I'm using the motor in a janky belt grinder I've built. Although there's nothing stopping me from putting it back in the tile saw.

Offline NeoTech

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Re: Machining AlNiCo
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2013, 03:59:07 PM »
I guess if you get one of those diamond thread saws, then you can manually saw them i guess. =)
Machinery: Optimum D320x920, Optimum BF20L, Aciera F3. -- I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work. http://www.roughedge.se/blogg/

Offline cidrontmg

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Re: Machining AlNiCo
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2013, 10:43:45 PM »
Alnico is not toxic (aluminium, nickel and cobalt), another thing is the fine dust if you grind the magnets. But if you grind it, it will mostly stick in the magnets anyway   :doh:
Alnico is somewhat "obsolete-ish", although they can machine somewhat, with difficulties. It's hard and brittle, diamond saws and disc grinders would work. About 800 ºC, Alnico loses magnetism, so cool frequently!
Samarium and neodymium are way far powerful magnets than Alnico. But they are far worse to cut or grind. The  samarium/neodymium magnet "blocks" are encapsulated, usually with nickel, and you should not peel their nickel sheath.  Neodymium metal dust is a combustion and explosion hazard. Neodymium dust and salts are very irritating to the eyes and mucous membranes, and moderately irritating to skin. Neodymium quickly oxidizes in ordinary air. And neodymium magnets lose their magnetism in only 300-350 ºC. Powerful, but...  :bang:
Same thing for samarium. Fender guitars were samarium magnets, just about the same as (powerful) neodymium magnets, and they lose magnetism about 700 ºC, way better than neodymium. But, if you peel off the nickel sheath, samarium slowly oxidizes at room temperature, and spontaneously ignites at 150 °C...  :zap:
All in all, it might be a wiser move to buy 2 guitar pickups, and maybe cannibalize their pole magnets. They're next to nothing in China or Korea. You'll get Abilene S Style (Strat)  Electric Guitar; Maple Neck, 3 Pickups, Korea, £32.48. 3 pickups = 18 polemagnets...   :D
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Offline S. Heslop

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Re: Machining AlNiCo
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2013, 09:10:02 AM »
Alnico is not toxic (aluminium, nickel and cobalt), another thing is the fine dust if you grind the magnets. But if you grind it, it will mostly stick in the magnets anyway   :doh:
Alnico is somewhat "obsolete-ish", although they can machine somewhat, with difficulties. It's hard and brittle, diamond saws and disc grinders would work. About 800 ºC, Alnico loses magnetism, so cool frequently!
Samarium and neodymium are way far powerful magnets than Alnico. But they are far worse to cut or grind. The  samarium/neodymium magnet "blocks" are encapsulated, usually with nickel, and you should not peel their nickel sheath.  Neodymium metal dust is a combustion and explosion hazard. Neodymium dust and salts are very irritating to the eyes and mucous membranes, and moderately irritating to skin. Neodymium quickly oxidizes in ordinary air. And neodymium magnets lose their magnetism in only 300-350 ºC. Powerful, but...  :bang:
Same thing for samarium. Fender guitars were samarium magnets, just about the same as (powerful) neodymium magnets, and they lose magnetism about 700 ºC, way better than neodymium. But, if you peel off the nickel sheath, samarium slowly oxidizes at room temperature, and spontaneously ignites at 150 °C...  :zap:
All in all, it might be a wiser move to buy 2 guitar pickups, and maybe cannibalize their pole magnets. They're next to nothing in China or Korea. You'll get Abilene S Style (Strat)  Electric Guitar; Maple Neck, 3 Pickups, Korea, £32.48. 3 pickups = 18 polemagnets...   :D

Thank's for the rundown. It's interesting stuff.

That was my first intention with buying a cheap guitar though, but it turns out that the really cheap guitar pickups have steel slugs with a bar magnet lying underneath them all. I'll still be able to make use of some of the other hardware at least.

The magnets (on this website at least) aren't really too expensive, and you can even mix and match their lengths. I bought them from ebay instead mostly becuase it's a much easier buying process, but I didn't really consider the challenges of machining them at the time.
http://www.cermag.co.uk/buy_guitar_pickup_magnet.html

But yeah thanks for the advice. I'll have to finish off using the belt grinder before I can switch the motor back to the tile saw though.