Author Topic: just my bit  (Read 5174 times)

Offline krv3000

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just my bit
« on: June 07, 2012, 10:06:39 AM »
HI all just my say when it cums to lathe and machinery maintenance sum say you must do this and others say you must do that the first thing you shod do is go to is the makers Manuel for guidance on wot where and when this in its self is full of misleading information the point I'm getting at is OIL ? do miford have a oil refinery Du's any of the other brands have one the answer is no  one comment i have just read regarding a mill they say we take their oil and mix it to provide you with the oil needed for their mill  i don't think so  they will go to a oil suppler and get the same oil as all the other manufachers are using  and just put their brand name on it sum people say you shod not use engine oil sum say do well if your lathe has white metal bearings then why not as all car engines crank shafts run in white metal bearings and go threw more stick than the bearings in your head stock my point being any oil is beter than no oil keep the mashen kleen oil it every time you play with it and it will out last you

Offline hopefuldave

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Re: just my bit
« Reply #1 on: June 07, 2012, 03:27:44 PM »
Yup, any oil's better than *no* oil, agreed!

But... One of the additives in motor oil is a detergent, designed to keep the crap suspended because *it all gets filtered* in a vehicle motor - most lathes aren't fitted with a filter, so the crap gets repeatedly passed through the bearings, between the gear teeth etc. - machine oils don't have the detergents, so the crap will at least settle in nooks and crannies, getting it out of circulation (eventually).

A lot of the extreme pressure (EP) additives in modern motor oils / transmission oils can also be quite hard on copper / zinc alloys (e.g. bronze / Oilite bushes, thrust washers etc.), so aren't a good idea :(

OK, the machine makers don't have their own refineries, but the guys who do (Shell, Castrol, Mobil etc.) make oils specifically for machine use - and the lathe/mill/whatever makers pick one or more that match the working conditions they expect - most often a standard hydraulic oil, sometimes something a bit more exotic - like mine, the original recommendation for the headstock was Shell Tellus 2, now discontinued, an ISO 5 hydraulic oil, which is incredibly thin (high-speed plain white-metal bearings are fussy!), the current replacement is 50/50 LHM hydraulic fluid (used in old Citroens and Rolls-Royces for the suspension, steering and brakes) and paraffin to get the right ISO viscosity...

Running too heavy an oil in plain bearings will probably reduce the flow and so the lubrication, too light and there won't be the hydrostatic "cushion", so increased risk of contact and wear, too heavy an oil (or too much!) in a roller bearing and it can cause "hydraulic locking" where the rollers stop rolling and skid on the races, with increased wear or even seizure... Not nice!

Dave H. (the other one)
Rules are for the obedience of fools, and the guidance of wise men.

Offline doubleboost

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Re: just my bit
« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2012, 04:32:51 PM »
Hi
I think we have been hear before
I have used engine oil on my lathe ways for years  (not noticed any wear yet) :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Motorcycle spray chain lube for change wheels
On my colchester bantam lathe
I ran atf fluid in the headstock
If it can lubricate a auto gearbox with bronze bushes needle rollers & ball races
Running 400 horse power i am sure it must be better than hydraulic oil :doh: :doh: :doh:
A simple magnett in the bottom of the box will collect any (bits)
On a down side the red colour of the oil makes a oil leak look like blood :Doh: :Doh:
John

Offline krv3000

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Re: just my bit
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2012, 11:17:39 AM »
ups op end a can of worms  :bang: the pont that i was trying to get at is the price that the branded names charge for their oil compered to Wat is a valuable in your car shop

Offline Ned Ludd

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Re: just my bit
« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2012, 09:59:12 AM »
Hi Guys,
I'm not so sure that the detergent argument holds up in a "total loss" system, like the one most machines have. You could make an argument that keeping the crud in suspension is in fact a good idea, as it is carried away with the total loss.
If your machine has a recirculating system I have two things to say 1, ignore the above and use the recommended oil and 2, I'm jealous. :)
Ned
I know enough to do what I do, but the more I know the more I can do!

Leafy suburbs of NW London

Offline hopefuldave

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Re: just my bit
« Reply #5 on: June 11, 2012, 12:51:50 PM »
Recirculating pump with a sight-glass, a filter and a magnetic strainer... But just for the spindle and headstock gears! The (sealed) gearboxes have their own oil and are splash-lubricated, apron the same but with a one-shot pump that oils the cross-slide, carriage ways and half-nuts... *LOADS* of oil nipples all over the place, too - I reckon on a good 5-10 minutes to get it oiled up before use, while the headstock oil warms up at low speed - bit like a steam loco, really :)

Jealous now?  :poke:

Dave H. (the other one)

Rules are for the obedience of fools, and the guidance of wise men.

Offline AdeV

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Re: just my bit
« Reply #6 on: June 11, 2012, 03:31:33 PM »
Blimey. I give the 1-shot a pull on the Bridgeport (ahem, Bridgeports now :D) as & when I remember, the lathe gets a dousing in hydraulic oil as & when it looks like it needs it (I do try to keep the gearbox & headstock topped up properly).... Currently, all the machines are getting plain hydraulic oil, I should probably invest in some way oil for the mills.
Cheers!
Ade.
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Location: Wallasey, Merseyside. A long way from anywhere.
Occasionally: Zhengzhou, China. An even longer way from anywhere...

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Re: just my bit
« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2012, 04:25:52 PM »
I use what ever i have in the back of  my van ,,,, Hydraulic , engine oil and chain spray  ,,,,,,,,,,,  maybe only oil my machines once a month if there lucky  :)


Rob


Edit ,,,,,,,,Shaper gets loads of oil when in uses ,engine oil  :med: