Author Topic: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......  (Read 53753 times)

Offline John Rudd

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #75 on: May 26, 2011, 12:11:14 PM »
CoS,

See my photo attached........

I have all the documentation pertaining to the KBLC boards including the factory set up for all the preset adjustments if needed.

R21 is annotated on the right hand side in RED, although not very clear.........



 
eccentric millionaire financed by 'er indoors
Location:  Backworth Newcastle

Skype: chippiejnr

Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #76 on: May 26, 2011, 12:19:49 PM »
Gottit John! Thank you!  :clap:

And..... It does unplug, with a firm pull!  :thumbup:

The new board has the same sort of thing, in the same place.......

Guess nothing needs swapping over......

David D



David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline John Rudd

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #77 on: May 26, 2011, 01:21:01 PM »
Gottit John! Thank you!  :clap:

And..... It does unplug, with a firm pull!  :thumbup:
David D


Glad to have helped someone today.....
eccentric millionaire financed by 'er indoors
Location:  Backworth Newcastle

Skype: chippiejnr

Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #78 on: May 27, 2011, 08:58:29 AM »
YEEeeeee......... HAAaaaaaarrrrrr!!!!!!! :ddb: :ddb: :ddb: :ddb:

I've got me lathe back! It works!  :D

Initial impressions.......

A really good brake...... It never really operated before, especially after fitting a 4" chuck.
No creep.... No hunting.....
Slightly higher revs. Slightly less torque.
I can now hand rotate the chuck, "in reverse". Without it fighting me......


Thank you all, for caring......   :thumbup:

David D
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline John Swift

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #79 on: May 27, 2011, 09:12:29 AM »


 Hi Dave

 thats the result we have been waiting for   :D :) :D :) :D

 a job well done  :beer:

 John

Offline andyf

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #80 on: May 27, 2011, 10:24:01 AM »
 :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

It would be interesting to know how Dave BC gets on with fixing the old board, if he gets round to it.

Andy
Sale, Cheshire
I've cut the end off it twice, but it's still too short

Offline Bluechip

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #81 on: May 27, 2011, 10:40:30 AM »
:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

It would be interesting to know how Dave BC gets on with fixing the old board, if he gets round to it.

Andy

Picking the dead board up tomorrow at Eastwood AFIAK.

Anyway ....

It's all very well his controller chirping up ....  :clap:

My telly now has a 6" x 4" picture ...  :(  :(

And me toaster is taking 3 hours to dry a slice of bread ...

Dave BC
I have a few modest talents. Knowing what I'm doing isn't one of them.

lordedmond

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #82 on: May 27, 2011, 11:20:41 AM »
good news


its good when a plan comes together  with no release of more magic smoke

Andyf   I bet its the motor not the board

Stuart

should be over Sat if I can park near enough I can only do about 20 yards
« Last Edit: May 27, 2011, 11:22:29 AM by lordedmond »

Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #83 on: May 31, 2011, 04:00:50 PM »
Mentioning magic smoke........

Was doing a bit of roughing this afternoon......




Not very big licks......




5" dia aluminium castings. 10 thou each pass. Approx 200/ 250rpm.......




Had to use a parting tool. All I'd got to pass over the o/d.

Never bogged down/ stalled. Seemed to be machining nicely.......

BUT..... I had that hot paint smell again! Just like a new car exhaust system....... :bang:

The motor was warm, only. Nothing else was hot. Anyone any ideas?

David D
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline John Swift

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #84 on: May 31, 2011, 04:40:24 PM »

Hi Dave  ,

all being well its just the lacquer on the new motor or the horse power resistor running hot the first time

one thing to look at could be the 1/4" lucar push-on connectors

if the are like the ones on my CL300M lathe  they don't grip very well once you disturb them

I replaced them with new ones make from thicker brass

     John

Offline krv3000

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #85 on: May 31, 2011, 06:32:59 PM »
hi im glad my old lathe runs on belts   :mmr:

Offline Dean W

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #86 on: May 31, 2011, 08:11:51 PM »



Pour water all over it, David.















 :D   JUST KIDDING!!!!!
Dean W.

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http://www.deansphotographica.com/machining/projects/projects.html

Praise the Lord and pass the Carbide!

Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #87 on: June 01, 2011, 02:12:07 AM »
Hmmm...... Thanks for your replies Chaps!  :thumbup:

Dean, I'll save that one for emergency only.......  :D

David D
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

lordedmond

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #88 on: June 01, 2011, 07:22:29 AM »
IMHO  its new equipment smell

new computers stink , cars smell nice


Its the lacquer gassing off keep it going and it will get less , you are thinking about it, as you did the work you are waiting for trouble ,


David  use it and enjoy it

Stuart

Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #89 on: June 01, 2011, 07:48:52 AM »
IMHO  its new equipment smell

new computers stink , cars smell nice


Its the lacquer gassing off keep it going and it will get less , you are thinking about it, as you did the work you are waiting for trouble ,


David  use it and enjoy it

Stuart

Have to agree with you Stuart.....  :thumbup:

BUT! The last motor did the same, at around 6yrs old... (1/3rd the way down page).......     http://madmodder.net/index.php?topic=3555.60

And we all know where that got me........  ::)

David D
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!

Offline andyf

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #90 on: June 01, 2011, 08:48:50 AM »
A chap with a small lathe like mine (Warco WM180 - same capacity as a "normal" mini-lathe, but different design and with a 550W motor) advised me that it is unwise to run the motor for more than 30 minutes per hour, particularly on large diameter jobs where low speed and high torque is involved. He burned out both his motor and control board after four hours’ continuous running when reducing a 3” OD steel tube to 2.25”, and boring its ID out from 1” to 2”.

I don't know where he got his duty cycle from; maybe he called Warco to grumble and they told him.

Andy
Sale, Cheshire
I've cut the end off it twice, but it's still too short

Offline Bluechip

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #91 on: June 01, 2011, 10:12:27 AM »
The weak point of these wretched controllers, FET or SCR, is this:

When you reduce the motor speed for turning large-ish diameters, you are putting a fair load on the motor, but the fan, miserable at the best of times, is now running slow. Hence reduced air-flow.

So, the poor old ( or new ) motor warms up a bit. Often these motors sit in a semi-enclosed casting. So, they cannot be said to be effectively cooled anyway, as they suck in a good percentage of 'pre-heated' air.

The whole idea of these contraptions is flawed for a machine tool like a lathe. If you reduce the average armature current through a PM motor, by whatever means you choose, you reduce the torque. Just when you need it most.

I had a Warco mini lathe, apparently you could screwcut at some 100 rpm. Well, 100 rpm is a bit fast for most screwcutting. But in any case, the chuck could be stopped quite easily by plonking my hand on it. No chance of screwcutting there .  :doh:

Now, I can put my Myford with it's belts and gears, at some 100 rpm, or lower. No way would I grab that chuck, it would probably pull my arm off. And only 1/2HP ! ... but, that 1/2 HP is there all the time.

Work out the torque for yourself ... I'll even do it for you ... for nowt. 

Power = torque x rpm. Motor rpm = 1425. 1 hp = 750 Watts ish. Call 1/2 HP 375W.

So,  Watts = (Newton metres) x ( rads / seconds).

Motor rpm = 1425
1425 RPM = about 24 rps
24 rps = about 150 rads/ sec

So, Torque = ( 375 / 150 ) =  roughly 2.5 Nm.

Multiply by 2.2 and 3.3 to get Ft lbs .... about 18 Ft Lbs.

Lowest backgear is 25 rpm ...

Still have the same 375 watts pushing it round ....

About 2.6 rads/sec. ...

Torque some 145 Nm.

908  Ft Lbs ... getting close to 1/2 foot.ton ...

More than enough to shear anyones nuts eh ???

So, assuming a 375W DC motor on a Chinky Lathe ... that's the same 1/2 HP ..

Your controller get anywhere near 1/2 Ft.Ton at 25 RPM ???

These machines with Electronic motor controllers are not like belt and gear machines.
They simply don't have enough guts.
Electronic circuits are very cheap to produce. Accurate mechanical parts are not.

Looking at the KB controller, I doubt very much if they cost much more then £5 to make.

Even at 1-off retail the parts only add up to about £9, OK, so no PCB counted in at that, but if you buy enough, they're not wildly expensive. Not small ones similar to the KB one anyway.

Not surprised Andyf's friend got that reply from Warco.

I think it is an honest answer.
Not one any supplier would boast about in the sales literature though .. wonder why ???



I hope the maths is OK ... no doubt some one will advise ..  :smart:

Dave BC






 










 
I have a few modest talents. Knowing what I'm doing isn't one of them.

Offline Stilldrillin

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Re: Mini Lathe Electrikery.......
« Reply #92 on: October 25, 2011, 01:02:35 PM »
:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

It would be interesting to know how Dave BC gets on with fixing the old board, if he gets round to it.

Andy

For those of you with long memories, who are hanging on for an outcome to this saga.  :wave:

A certain electrically orientated young man sent me a pm, t'other week.......   (Sorry.... I've been a bit distracted!).  ::)


Your speed controller is fixed ...

Snubber capacitor gone pop ....

Had it running today for 2 hrs OK.




I think he's a gem!   :D

Thanks Dave! :thumbup:

David D
David.

Still drilling holes... Sometimes, in the right place!

Still modifying bits of metal... Occasionally, making an improvement!