Chinese Lathe CO6230A

[GerryB]

G.day All,
Farther Christmas is alive and well,he just went down our street.
Which means that i purchased a new lathe.
I paid and collected it from a local merchant who placed the huge box on to my trailer.
It weighs half a ton and there was no way i was going to get it into my shed.
So i decided to dismantle it and rebuild it in the place i decided.
Its funny but the sheds out hear in Australia are quite large compared to the units in the UK but you seem to fill them up just the same
so there is no room to swing the cat.
I finally got the packing case off and started the dismantling process.
I needed to have the whole unit moved off the trailer so the the Headstock over hung the end.
Backed the trailer to a tree on the front lawn secured the lathe to the tree and drove forward 18",great.
This enabled me to get  at the various securing devices.
Removed the Motor,Electric Box,Pickoff gears,Chuck,Stedies,Head Stock etc.
Now comes the funny part,the Saddle and Apron will not part until the Gear Box with the 3 driven shafts are removed.
Does anyone have the know how as to how and in what order i need to go so that i end up with the bare lathe bed.?
GerryB

[Bogstandard]

Not knowing exactly what lathe you have, but I suspect something similar to mine.

http://www.chesteruk.net/store/crusader_lathe.htm

If it is around this size, I recommend you DON'T split it. Even taking the gap bed slug out in your warranty period will invalidate the whole warranty. Read the small print.

The other and more major worry is getting the head back on in the same position it came off, that is the reason for not removing the gap slug, they can't guarantee it will go back in the same position, although on mine, I do have jacking screws to realign the head if needed. But in all honesty, taking it apart is not something I would like to do, purely because of all the work that will be required to get it cutting spot on after it is reassembled.

Personally, what I would do in your situation is organise a lathe moving bar-b-q. A few strong fellows, some ropes, pieces of wood and a few pipe rollers will soon get it into position as it is.

Mine was moved into my shop using a 1 ton engine crane, but still required 3 people to push and pull.


Bogs

[John Hill]

Hi Gerry

I too have a lathe like Bogstandard's which I assume is the same as yours.

If you really want to remove the carriage from the lathe you can do it easily enough but it does require a little care.   What you need to do is tap out the tapered pins that drive those drive rods and remove the bearing block from the other end of the bed.  The lower switch rod does not have a tapered pin so for that one just disconnect the handle bracket from the apron gear box, if you lathe is really like mine oil will pour out as they drilled and tapped right through the side of the box!

Then you undo those socket screws on the top of the carriage which seperates the apron gear box from the saddle.  Lift the apron gear box and the rods to one side.    You will then be able to slide the carriage off the lathe, though I have never done that bit I believe it would be possible.

It was Chester UK's own engineer who told me how to get that apron gear box off.

Like Bogstandard, I wouldnt recommend dismantling your lathe unless you really have to but it sounds like you already have most of the heavy bits off?

[GerryB]

G.Day John,
Thanks for your info on removing the Gear Box and Saddle unit.
Its a pitty that the Saddle is located to the Apron by taper pins.
I could understand short location pins that would allow the Saddle to be lifted off without disturbing the rest.
Maybe when i come to reassemble the lathe i will remove the taper pins and replace them with normal straight ones.
I also came upon another problem during dismantling and that was that the Electric Box was secured to the Head Stock facing to the rear.
Now i realise that it would not be a problem if the lathe is placed in an area large enough to be able to walk all  around it but how often have you seen this happen.
I know that it happens in a designed factory layout.
So seeing that my unit will have to be up against a bulkhead with no way of getting to the back i will reposition the Electric Box some where convenient.
Re the removal of the Gear Box,there are holes located on the front plate that allow the security bolts to be removed without having to remove the front plate and loosing the oil.
GerryB.

[John Hill]

Gerry, it sounds like you are really getting into that machine!

The apron gear box just fell off the saddle when I had disconnected the drive shafts and unscrewed the cap screws.

John

[GerryB]

John.
I put my back out yesterday moving targets on the range so i will be held up for a few days.
Will let you know how i get on when ime mended.
Gerry

[Pete49]

Gerry as was suggested go called a couple mates or 3 and ask them to help before something goes wrong and you injure yourself or the lathe. Me & a mate got mine into position and we are over 60  . I found it was easier to move gear out of the way, place lathe in position then replace the geared moved out. See if you can beg, borrow or buy an engine crane (cheap nowdays) and your move will be easy as 
Cheers
Pete

[GerryB]

G.Day each,
Thanks for all the come backs.very much appreciated.
After a couple of days rest watching the magic box my back is on the mend.
I did not do my back in playing with the Lathe but on another activity i follow.
When i collected the Lathe from the supplier it was placed on my trailer in 3 packing box's.
The largest contained the Lathe,tray,splash back,tool box,foot operating leaver and 4 jaw chuck in a box.
The other 2 box's held the Base Cabinets.
Now it means that i drill holes in the deck where i intend to place the Lathe.
Assemble and bolt down the base,fit the tray and the foot operating leaver.
Now comes the funny part,how would you lift the Lathe up onto the base unit in a shed that already contains other machines etc.?
So this is why i intended to dismantle the Lathe so that only the base would have to be lifted by some strong buddies before the Beer and BBQ.
Rebuilding the Lathe is not a problem plus i will know more about the machine plus any modifications that i envisage like the repositioning of the Electric Box.
I dont know if any of you guys know that there are Trip Switches (3) in with the various Relays, Transformer etc that will need to be reset if tripped.
So if like me your lathe is against some bulkhead,no way will you be able to get to it.
GerryB

[Bogstandard]

Gerry,

BTW, I paid a professional to get my mill and lathe into my shop, that was all taken into account when I bought the machines. Each one took around 4 hours to get in there, and he had all the equipment to do it.

This little post is how he got the mill in. He came back a few weeks later after the suppliers had dropped the lathe off, and got it into the shop for me.

http://www.homemodelenginemachinist.com/index.php?topic=2314.msg23091#msg23091


By the sounds of it, your lathe is the same as mine. Designed to sit in the middle of the shop.

I have never used the flood coolant because the access panel is at the very back, not the front where it should be.

Mine is against a wall, like yours is going to be. In fact, I couldn't relocate the back electrical box if I wanted to, there is no room for it to go anywhere, in fact the lathe has about 25mm maneuvering space side to side, just enough to get the change gear cover off comfortably.

It was a PITA when the motor had to be changed just over a year ago, but with the help of a couple of good friends, we got the job done.

I was very inconvenient at the time, the hardest part was swinging the end of the lathe out to get to the motor, but now I am equipped with a pair of single wheeled toe jacks, which means it will be able to be swung out in minutes, job done and then back in again. That was the main reason the machine wasn't bolted to the floor, it just sits on it's 8 levelling feet (16mm bolts).

Sometimes you have to come up with alternative methods, just so that you can have the machinery you really want.


Bogs

[GerryB]

G.Day Bogs,
I fully understand your position,i have two other lathes (South Bend and  a Myford S7) that are not bolted down.
I will have to move the S7 to another position so that i can use the space for the new acquisition.
I have decided to secure it to the deck as a friend who has the same unit has done and has found that the extra security has given him a better finish on his projects.
Maybe we should take another look at Factory installations.
I can not see that the repositioning of the Electric Box will be too traumatic.
I envisage placing it beneath the Tray or in one of the Base Units or even on the bulkhead adjacent to the lathe and realise that i will have to extend the wiring.
GerryB

[Davo J]

I have the same lathe and had it bolted to the concrete floor for 6 years before moving it out into the center of the shed because of how I now have it set up now. I can tell you that having it bolted down makes a big difference especially with larger unbalanced jobs. Once it goes into the new shed it will be bolted down again.
I have never had a problem with electrics on my lathe at all in 7 or more years, but I did see one bloke mount the electrical box above the head stock strait up from where it is a but forward facing and I am sure he said the original wiring reached without mod's.

Dave

[GerryB]

G.Day Each,Thanks for your comments etc.
Well i have finally got the Lathe down to simple Lathe Bed.
Looking back i was a little apprehensive at first in having to take the Lathe apart but now its done i am not sorry.
I have more knowledge now of its design and construction and can appreciate my purchase.
I know that the Manufacture (Who ever it is) is trying his best to supply at a fair price and congratulate him on this.
There are a few little things that i think they need to take into account.
One would be the removal of Swarf and Casting Sand before Painting.
Two would be to Paint all bare metal surfaces.
Its not until you disassemble the unit do you find out these things.
Generally the Machining and Liberal use of Cast Iron is a plus.
Mind you i have yet to run the machine and wont until i reassemble it.
When i come to rebuild  in a suitable spot in my shed is will be able to do the things that were missed during assembly at the factory.
Such as Painting the parts missed.
The Instruction Manual supplied is a plus,giving a lot of information and exploded views,part no's etc.
They even give a Circuit  Diagram of the Electrics for Three Phase and Single Phase.
I will have to fill the Head Stock with a suitable Oil,also the Saddle and Gear Box.
The Manual gives instructions on doing this operation also i time frame but no recommendation on the best type of oil to use.
I have been making enquiries on the best oil for the job and was recommended Mobil ISO 8/DTE 24.
Apparently this oil is available in small quantities.
Does anyone have information on the Oil issue,also suitable Oil for the Bed Ways etc?
I was once told 'never to use Engine Oil' 'or 3 In One' but when it comes down to it any thing is better than nothing.
GerryB

[Bogstandard]

The general consensus is, and also confirmed by my lathe supplier, for the gearboxes, a lightweight hydraulic oil, something like Tellus 32, the 32 is the main part, most manufacturers use that number in their hydraulic oil coding. That is also used for general lubrication about the lathe where you have the little ball oilers. Usually you can buy a gallon (or 5 litres) from farm supplies, for hydraulics on tractors etc or general engineering supplies.

For sliding surfaces, like bedways, a good general purpose bedway oil is recommended, and that usually has a 68 in it's coding. Like this

http://www.chronos.ltd.uk/acatalog/1-Litre-of-Multispec-Slideway-Oil.html

A litre should last at least a year, maybe a lot longer, so good insurance for little money. I tend to over lube my slideways, a big squirt at the start of each machining day, and run the bed up and down a couple of times while giving it some.


Bogs

[GerryB]

Thanks Bogs,
From my days in Naval Aircraft,Hydraulic Oil was ether Synthetic or Vegitable Based and depended on the type of Rubber Seals used.
If a Mechanic put Synthetic Oil in the tank then the seals would crinkle up.pressure would be lost and you went for a swim.
GerryB

[GerryB]

G Day Each,this will be the Third time i have attempted to write this.
I finaly moved the Myford S7 to its new position.
The space now made available for the new Lathe was viewed in the light of installing the Lathe end on and not against the Bulkhead as first envisaged.
This will allow me to install as supplied and not having to modify.
The Instruction Manual supplied give's dimentions of the mounting holes needed to secure the base to the deck.
I addvise anyone attempting instalation to take care.
If i had fitted the mounting bolts to the deck as per directions i would not have been able to fit the base correctly.
After inspecting the holes in both base's it was found that they were not alltogether square with each other.
So i set up the Base's according to the Lathe Bed and marked the deck through the holes.
The best way to do this would be to set the Lathe up completly and mark the holes,then lift the whole unit free in order to drill and fit the bolt units then to lift the Lathe up and on to the bolts,easy!
As i had dismantled my Lathe i set up the Base's to the required dimentions of the holes in the Lathe Bed.
This made it easy as i only had to mark the position of the holes,lift the Base's away,drill and fit the bolts than lift the Base's onto the Bolts.
GerryB

[GerryB]

Continued.
The Lathe comes with a Foot Brake assy. that attaches to a brake unit on the pully drive.
There is no mention of this unit in the Manual supplied so also no instruction as to its assembly and set up.
I did manage to down load an Instruction Manual from the Grizzly site in the USA.which dose show an exploded view of a simmular arrangement,but it is not like mine.
I have made a simulated set up that will probebly work but have not secured any thing yet i am wondering if any one has a correct assembly diagram?
This Saturday i have invited a number of likly lads (and their Familes)to a BBQ with the intention of getting them to first lift the Lathe Bed off the Trailer and into the shed.
After that they can drown their sorrows(you are invited)
GerryB

[GerryB]

G.Day again,
I have just taken a butchers at the rear of the Apron.
Now this is seldom seen by owners due to the complication in removing it.
The first thing i noticed was the lack of paint on the rear or the side that you dont see.
Then i noticed the Worm drive assy down on the bottom that drives the Apron and the Cross Slide,it is DRY,no lube at all.
Although it is mounted well in a cast surround there seemed no way it will be lubricated and unlike the Half Nuts that can be lubricated via the Lead Screw.
I can envisage problems in the future so am thinking about fitting an oil feed system on the lines of a copper tube topped with a suitable oil cup.
Has anyone come across  this possible problem?.
GerryB

[Bogstandard]

It is all very difficult to visualise without a few pictures  

Then maybe we could comment a little more.


Bogs

[John Hill]

G.Day again,
I have just taken a butchers at the rear of the Apron.
Now this is seldom seen by owners due to the complication in removing it.
The first thing i noticed was the lack of paint on the rear or the side that you dont see.
Then i noticed the Worm drive assy down on the bottom that drives the Apron and the Cross Slide,it is DRY,no lube at all.
Although it is mounted well in a cast surround there seemed no way it will be lubricated and unlike the Half Nuts that can be lubricated via the Lead Screw.
I can envisage problems in the future so am thinking about fitting an oil feed system on the lines of a copper tube topped with a suitable oil cup.
Has anyone come across  this possible problem?.
GerryB

Hi Gerry

 I will take another look at mine but my first thought is that those parts can be reached by a long spout on an oil can? 

Being in our new house with the lathe just a few steps from the kitchen table its no problem for me to check, so I did, and my worm and wheel are easy to reach from the right hand side of the gear box, either an oil can or a stick with a dob of grease would be easy to apply.  Mine already looks very oily due no doubt to oil seeping out of the gear box via the shafts etc.

John

[GerryB]

G.Day Each,thanks for the come back.
I did give the Apron a further look at this morning with the intention  of making and fitting a suitable oil way.
I was woundering wether the Worm could get some form of lubrication from the shaft that goes through the Apron casting and into the Aprons Main Box which holds oil for the lubrication of the gears.
As the lathe has not yet run(except testing during manufacture) it is possible that no oil has been able to get through and that is why its dry.
I also saw that the unit that operates the Clasp Nut and mechanisam to disengage the mechanical drive is also dry but as you say John a few squerts with the oil can and there you go.
If i had not dismantled the lathe in order to erect it in the shed i would not be aware of these possible problems.
My other two lathes(South Bend and Myford) do not seem to get problems with lubrication,or none that i am aware of.
GerryB

[GerryB]

G.Day Bogs,i have not missed you.
Yes i agree that a picture tell more than the words can.
I will attempt to include a few photo's during the reassembly.
GerryB

[GerryB]

G.Day Each.
Well the BBQ went well,i got the Guys working before the Beer and Wine began to flow.
We managed to manhandle the Bed off the Trailer and onto the Bases secured to the deck.
I have started to assemble the Lathe and came across a few problems,not to do with the disassembly but to do with the setting up of the unit as supplied.
First off there was no instructions or even a mention of the Foot operated Brake Unit.
I assembled it to what i thought was correct and put small pins in the security holes for the time being.all went well.
Unpacking the Suds Pump unit i could not help noticing a Micro Switch (WWII aircraft pattern) on the end of the cable,or so i thought.
Apparently it was a seperate cable assy.and nothingto do with the Suds Unit.
Having rewired the control box to as received,i connected the Lathe to the Mains and pressed the Button.
The Motor started to run ok but as soon as i let go of the Button it stopped.
Checking the Relays found only one was operating,traced fault to the missing micro switch which i fond fitted on the end plate of the Foot operating unit.
Fitted Micro Switch and set the mechanism to correct positions and secured.
Now  i have two problems to set straight.
One where to connect the leads from the Micro Switch and two where to connect the leads for the Suds Pump,

[GerryB]

Continuation .-
The Wireing diagram in the Manual is of little use as there is no indication as to what the wire colours are or what the switches are.
Also there is no Suds Pump or Lamp.
So its back to tracing wiring.
I did find that the Mains cable colour for the Live Wire is BLACK,Negative is Blue and Earth Green/Yellow.
I remember when working on German Juke Boxes in the Fifties/Sixties that the Earth cable was RED.
I have managed to obtain some Oil for the Head Stock also some new Suds Oil which is Water based,like the old suds but is surpposed to be less messy than the cutting oil.
When i have got everything ship shape i will display some photo's i have taken of the setup.
GerryB

[GerryB]

G.Day Each,
Sorry for the time span since last note but the dreded Computer Virus struck.
I had to reinstall the whole lot and of course lost all my contacts etc.
Got it back and running ok except that i have no sound (back to the drawing board)
I have finally got the lathe up and running to my satisfaction and am very pleased with it.
I took various pictures of the build and will attempt to show you what i  have achieved.
GerryB

[GerryB]

This is the finished set up so far,a few more mods to make in time.