Safety Alert Defect in MAPP bottle/ torch heads

[PTsideshow]

Since people use these torches for patina's and bending small quick pieces. In addition to soldering, I thought it would be good to post.

This site appears to be one of the injured looking for others that have been injured. I have had one since they first came out almost 10 years ago, I have dropped just the head and the fracture joint didn't work. It is a top heavy torch, and I generally hold the bottle when I use it. But I also hold the bottle on the regular style head to as that is the way I learned 53 or so years ago when the bottles and heads made their debut for home owners.


The photo compares a regular torch head with the style in question.
Ran across this while looking something else up. Can't believe that it isn't out there more.
Information on defects with a Bernz-o-matic torch head and certain MAPP gas bottles. With a link to the website with the info and photo's Be forewarned that they have a number of graphic photo's of the injuries, from 3 of the parties.

Bernz-o-matic torch MAPP injuries link

They are rebranded under a number of different names.
MAPP Gas Cylinder and Torch Injury Database
(Bernzomatic, Worthington, Lenox, Ace, Sears, Thermadyne, etc.)

So if you use either be careful and safe rather than sorry!

[spuddevans]

This is good to know, Thanks.


It's interesting too, just in the last year the big orange DIY place has removed the old Mapp gas fittings and bottles from sale, actually they sold them all off at 1/2 price, I nearly bought myself a setup. Now they have replaced the range with a new range of Mapp gas torches and bottles that are not compatable with the old system. I wonder if this is as a result of the weakness that you have highlighted?


Tim

[AdeV]

Now they have replaced the range with a new range of Mapp gas torches and bottles that are not compatable with the old system. I wonder if this is as a result of the weakness that you have highlighted?

I just bought a bottle today from the Big Orange One. It's made by the same people who are in the frame for the website PTSideshow linked - not sure what the old system was like, I didn't have a torch then.

I shall be extra-careful not to drop mine, I think  Of course, a MadModder could probably come up with some kind of bracket which supported the torch (above the fracture joint - no need to wreck the expensive bit) and the bottle so that if the whole apparatus is dropped, it just bounces around setting fire to stuff, instead of exploding...

[Rob.Wilson]

Cheers PT 

I have one of those touches ,,, so off into the shop i pops ,,, grabs the bottle with one hand , the touch with tother  ,, a slight tweak and it split at the weld ,,, i have seen thicker coke cans ,,, always thought there was something dodge about those bottles .

took no effort to tare the hole top off the bottle



mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm what to do 

Rob

[John Swift]

I'm glad I don't have one of those torches

but it got me thinking what other time bombs I might have

gas for my mig welder at 2000 psi ?

  John

[Rob.Wilson]

Well not wanting to go to    .

I really do like the torch as its great for small jobs and very controllable and dose light instantly and goes out when the trigger is released   ,no hunting around for a lighter . NOT TRUSTING THE BOTTLES NOW , but not wanting to scrap the torch , i had an idea    ,, i just turned down the bottle end so i could  connect to a large gas bottle .

 

Rob

[Bernd]

Rob,

You just don't know your own streangth that's all. 

Does look dangerous though. Just think if your torch was lit and you did that. Now need to get a hair cut after that.

Bernd

[PTsideshow]

Yep I have to agree on the torch as the one when I bought mine 10 or so years ago, was able to use propane or MAPP. And I love it for some things, but when have adapters to go from bulk cylinders to the bottle fittings. To convert it to a hosed hand torch.






It also works with the TS7000

On 31 April 2008 the Petromont Varennes plant closed its methylacetylene/propadiene plant. As they were the only North American plant making MAPP gas, indeed the only legal supplier of trademarked MAPP gas in the world, this caused a wide scale shortage, and many substitutes were introduced by the companies who had repackaged the Dow and Varennes product(s) - most of these substitutes are propylene, like MAP//Pro   from BernzOmatic, some are mixtures with higher hydrocarbons or with other ingredients like acetone. Many of these work just about acceptably in gas/air torches, but none work as well as MAPP in gas/oxygen torches.

They have altered the formula slightly to continue to sell a modified product with a higher heat range.

Don'y know if they are already doing it on your side of the pond but they have come out with NEW green fuel cylinders, and torches. That maybe why they don't fit. From looking at and reading the BS on the site. It sounds like more global warming BS, they paid money to Al the bore Gore to get his blessing and use the little icon on the packaging. I got a letter a couple years ago form his non profit saying If I sent them $5,000 I could have the right to use the icon for a number of years. Legal scam for stealing money. But that's another story 

[Rob.Wilson]

Rob,

You just don't know your own streangth that's all.  

Does look dangerous though. Just think if your torch was lit and you did that. Now need to get a hair cut after that.

Bernd

 nope just crap gas bottles  

gas bottle was empty when i pulled the end off . i am not as green as i am cabbage lookin   ( probably would come off easier with some pressure in the bottle )  ,,,,,,,,, the thing is this type of torch has auto ignition  , so you pull the trigger it lights up , leave go it goes out  ,, nice and safe ,,,,,, BUT you can lock it on ,, and with the weight of the touch on the bottle its NOT sable when you stand it up ,,,,,, so if it was knocked off the bench when on    ,, well i would hate to think of what may happen in a small shop ,, the photos in PT's link show enough .

Rob

On the up side , was going to get a new bottle today ,,,,,,,, saved a few £  cheers PT and thanks again for the heads up  

[cfellows]

Is there a specific type of cylinder one should look for when buying Mapp gas?

Chuck

[Dean W]

It looks like more tort lawyer BS trying to make some poor souls and themselves rich for doing something stupid.
These things come with explicit instructions for operation.  If someone doesn't follow them, the rest of us shouldn't
have to pay higher prices for products due to their incompetence.

I have three of these torches.  They work great for the smaller hard soldering jobs I do.  Now, because of the lawyers,
I can soon expect to pay twice as much for the same product in a new package.

[PTsideshow]

As MAPP gas is no longer made as in my other post since 2008 any bottles that are labeled MAPP gas might fall in to the time line. And are NOS (New old stock) Since they have changed the formula for it and also the names of the gas.
Its would be hard to say. It will be a judgment call, from now on. Either convert the torch to a hosed bulk cylinder rig Like Rob did or my example in the previous posts. Or don't use MAPP gas bottles.

They now are going to green gases and bottles and I understand that the short squat bottles called Fat Boy's will replace the skinny bottles.

They are more stable than the old style ones. Again the skinny ones will probably be around for a while with millions in the distributors pipe line.

Don't know if any of this will help!

[Dean W]

The short squat Fat Boy one that you show has been around for at least 25 years.  Coleman brought them out because
they fit a certain camping lamp and single burner stove, and didn't put the stove 18" off the top of the table.  The Fat Boy
bottles are the same propane gas that has been sold for decades in the skinny blue bottles.  They put a little green cap
on these, and now call them "green".  It's marketing hype.
All these gases, propane, MAPP, and the "new" MAP are hydrocarbon fuels.  They all contain mainly propane.  I don't know
if that is considered a "green" fuel.  Doesn't matter really.  It's all hooey anyway.

[PTsideshow]

They were camping bottles, and only in propane. Before the new green push as from Bernz-o-matics web site.
fuel cylinders Bernz-o-matic is now supplying

Green bottles has to do with recycling the bottles

This is for The US other countries may be different.

[Dean W]

Glen, yes the Coleman short fat bottles were filled with propane.  What I'm getting at is, the "new" bottles from Bernzomatic are
the same as the old Coleman bottles, which have been around for years.  They are painted a different color for different gases,
but are the same short fat bottles.  Bernzo just didn't always use them.
 
I don't know what they could mean by "green".  The so called new "MAP" is almost pure propylene,
which is just another type of LPG.
That little green plug in the cap has been in the old Coleman fat camp bottles for years, too.  Maybe Bernzomatic is doing some
kind of catch up game.  Really, I wish they'd quit changing things.  They had a good product from the get go.