Author Topic: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)  (Read 156308 times)

Offline modeng200023

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1050 on: May 22, 2021, 12:59:28 PM »
That is real progress Andrew  :clap:

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1051 on: May 22, 2021, 01:09:44 PM »
Yes John, it's a bit of a relief to have actually machined something at last !

Of course the actual female A2-6 taper will be 'added' (subtracted really!) on the manual lathe.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline tom osselton

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1052 on: May 22, 2021, 05:34:26 PM »
Good to see it done.

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1053 on: May 23, 2021, 07:24:30 AM »
Only PART done Tom !

So this morning I made six off 12 mm location dowels, threaded  M6 axially for insertion and removal.

These dowels in theory should be below the next stage of milling and thus untouched, but although I don't know what steel they are made from (rescued shaft from a printer!) it isn't as hard as the EN19T billet so not an issue if it gets bitten. I threaded them all the way through just in case they get their heads cut off!)

Then I slackened the welded up clamping ring from the spoil plate to allow it to move a tad, and then lowered the inverted billet onto the dowels. Having added extra hold downs for the spoil plate in the form of two finger clamps, I tightened up the radial clamping set screws, and then the bolts holding the welded assembly onto the spoil plate. (Doing it in this order tends to pull the billet even more firmly downwards).

Manoeuvring the billet onto the dowels proved tricky with little to hold onto, but the handled magnets that I use to pick bits off the CNC Plasma Table proved very useful.

Then, checking everything that I could think to check I loaded up the TNC355 with the CNC code for the A2-5 side of the adaptor and pressed START. That was at 10:00 this morning - it's now coming up to 12:30 and there's an awful lot still to mill! Mind you I am running with a 50% over ride on the milling feeds after yesterdays jam.

 . . . more when it finishes.

« Last Edit: May 23, 2021, 07:56:23 AM by awemawson »
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1054 on: May 23, 2021, 08:45:57 AM »
Well time ticks by and it's still chewing away - 3-1/2 hours so far, but the shape is beginning to show:


Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Sea.dog

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1055 on: May 23, 2021, 10:23:16 AM »
Slowly, slowly, catchee monkey. Looking good, Andrew.

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1056 on: May 23, 2021, 12:20:11 PM »
Thanks Graham,

At long last the second side is milled. It was not an easy journey however. At one point I was watching it about to change tools having finished a particular pocket and about to drill some holes and it picked up my delicate and expensive Heidenhain probe, and was rushing at the surface with it :bugeye:

I just managed to hit the eStop in time to save the probe, but then had to investigate why. It turned out that I'd changed the spot drill in the simulation to a 10 mm one but not specified which pocket it was in so it defaulted to the highest number - where the probe is  :bang:

I edited out all the features already machined and carried on - all went well until tapping the six M10 sockets to mount the A2-5 chuck. Seems that the tap was longer than I'd specified, bottomed out and broke - my last M10 spiral flute tap :bang: Again I edited out the tapping and prior actions and re-ran the program to completion.

I will have to EDM out the tap and re-work things but I'm nearly there !

(but WHY did I start ????)

Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline Sea.dog

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1057 on: May 23, 2021, 12:31:05 PM »
These CNC machines are the work of the Devil  :lol:

At least you're lucky enough to have an EDM machine. How many others can say that they do?

Offline Muzzerboy

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1058 on: May 23, 2021, 04:06:21 PM »
Was that rigid tapping? I can't do that on my machine, so I either use a tension compression head or thread mill (I must admit I've only done this once so far). I have those torque limiting tap holders for my tension compression head and fondly imagine they would reduce the chances of a broken tap. Can't help thinking I might be a little disappointed if (when) the time comes.

So now you are set for another journey before the job is done, this time on the EDM. Nothing's easy but at least we will get some interest out of it!

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1059 on: May 23, 2021, 04:12:10 PM »
It should have been one of the stretchy holders that allow for slight pitch / feed discrepancies but I'm not sure it it is as the machine tucked it away in the carousel before I could grab it - another job for tomorrow to check - replacement spiral flute machine taps on order!

But in any case it was my own fault. Too long a tap in too short a hole never ends happily ! 
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline tom osselton

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1060 on: May 23, 2021, 06:15:04 PM »
That was lucky with the probe they are expensive for what they are I snapped one on the Haas doing a reading. I just bought some ridged tap collets Friday 1/4, 3\8, 1/2” as we were always wondering about tap slippage.

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1061 on: May 24, 2021, 04:48:21 AM »
Today's job is to remove that broken tap, but first I wanted a 'sanity check' that the circle of 12 mm mounting stud holes are accurately placed. There are 12 threaded holes in the lathe spindle, the chuck uses six of them in three pairs to avoid the jaw mechanism, my adaptor uses six, but evenly spaced.

Sitting my adaptor on the reverse of the original chuck I could check three at a time and I'm glad to report that they are bang on. This will allow me to temporarily mount the adaptor on the spindle to turn the outer diameter concentric to the PCD of these studs, and I can pick this diameter up on the manual lathe to get concentricity when turning the female A2-6 recess.

OK let's work out how to get that tap out. I need to make a hollow copper electrode 8.5 mm (M10 tapping size ) for the Sinker EDM machine. This is easy. But the next step isn't - that's getting it accurately set up co-axial with the existing hole. The hole is blocked by the broken stub of the tap that I will have to shear off to see the target hole. Or possibly I can make a jig using the co-ordinates used to drill the holes in the first place. All a bit of a pain in the nether regions. So . . . . .

Think outside the box - revert to car mechanics techniques - weld a nut on the broken tap and wind it out (but it IS in pretty solidly!). And even if this doesn't work it will probably shear off the top of the tap which I need anyway.

There is not quite enough room for a 10 mm nut to turn fixed to the tap and clashing with the adjacent shoulder - probably about 20 thou interference. But I reasoned that after welding the nut will be dead soft - the shoulder is the EN19T hard stuff, and we should be OK. A good spraying with anti-spatter juice, a good heavy current Mig weld and . . .

 . . and sure enough - we are  :clap:

 
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline pycoed

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1062 on: May 24, 2021, 05:38:41 AM »
On the plus side, not only do you have your adapter(nearly), but also a useful M10 thread cleaner :clap:

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1063 on: May 24, 2021, 08:48:50 AM »
Very good  :clap:

During swarf clean up I found that one of the 16 welded on nuts had come adrift on the billet hold down plate. This probably happened when the big roughing cutter jammed cutting the first side of the chuck adaptor plate. Not particularly critical as the other nut on this set screw had held. No more heavy milling needed on the billet just drilling and tapping so no real problem.




I got the system to present me with the tap holder that still holds the stub  of the broken tap, and sure enough it is of the extensible type as it should be.





When the replacement M10 spiral flute machine tap arrives I will mount the billet up again, drill the 8.5 mm holes much deeper - in fact probably all the way through, then clench my teeth and tap the holes.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1064 on: May 25, 2021, 05:51:29 AM »
The replacement M10 tap arrived by this mornings post so I could proceed but firstly I modified the program to drill deeper holes. It means that they project into where the A2-6 female taper will be turned but I don't think that will matter much apart from giving me an interrupted cut.

I bought some spare M10 spiral flute taps as they are a common size that I use

Next stage is turning tapers  :thumbup:
« Last Edit: May 25, 2021, 10:20:53 AM by awemawson »
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline tom osselton

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1065 on: May 25, 2021, 06:08:38 PM »
Looks good and I really like that spiral bolt too!

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1066 on: May 30, 2021, 09:45:41 AM »
Things are going painfully slowly with this project - life is getting in the way!

However today's objective was to remove the temporary manual chuck from the lathe spindle, bolt the embryo adaptor in reverse on the nose of the spindle (as both have nice flat and true surfaces) and turn the periphery truly concentric as an aid to mounting on the manual lathe in a concentric fashion for turning the A2-6 taper.

It didn't go well from the start - I'd thought that the weight of the manual chuck would be manageable, well it wasn't - the good thing is that it just missed my foot when it fell into the swarf collector (where I was standing)  :bugeye:

OK I mounted the adaptor as planned in reverse . . . .but I've now concluded that I can't tweak it easily to be concentric for turning where it is and am going to remove it, return it to the accurate jig in the Partsmaster CNC milling machine, and use a boring head to produce an accurate concentric bore to use for centring on the manual lathe - what a pain !
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1067 on: May 31, 2021, 05:00:14 AM »
So this morning I whipped the embryonic adaptor off the CNC lathe spindle, cleaned everything up scrupulously, and sat it back on it's locating dowels in the Beaver Partsmaster ready for concentric boring.

But what to use as a boring head - I don't have a CAT40 shanked boring head  :scratch:

I've several R8 shanked ones that I use on the Bridgeport - mmm .... I wonder? Well the nominal diameter of an R8 shank is 24 mm - sit it in a 24 mm collet in a CAT40 shanked TG100 collet chuck (of which I have several) and see how a/ long the assembly is and b/ how rigid.

OK it's rather long and not brilliant for rigidity but it fits AND works. I decided to stick to low RPMs (150 rpm 43 mm diameter) and hand feed so that I had 'acoustic feedback' of how it was doing. It's not given a fantastic finish, not surprisingly, but it's OK for purpose which is merely to alow me to run a finger DTI on it on the manual lathe to ensure best concentricity. I'll see how it goes as it is.

(The nice thing about having six locating dowels on the spoil plate is that I can take it off and return it to exactly the same spot if further work is needed)

Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline mattinker

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1068 on: May 31, 2021, 06:03:35 AM »
That's Frankenstein set up! At least you didn't have to make a n R8 to CAT40 adaptor! All the best, Matthew

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1069 on: May 31, 2021, 04:11:24 PM »
Ah but it worked Matthew :lol:

(A CAT40 to R8 adaptor is actually available commercially but I've not seen one for sale in the UK)

So I mounted up the embryo adaptor in the 4 jaw chuck on the Colchester Master 2500, trued up the parallel faces of the A2-5 side, reversed it and started roughing out the A2-6 taper.

I decided not to finish bore it as time was getting on and there was pressure to do other things - I need to sink the test gauge about another 5 mm into the adaptor, but a job for another day. . . .

Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1070 on: June 02, 2021, 11:16:13 AM »
Today I managed to finish boring the A2-6 taper. I slightly overshot but was able to trim a tad off the outer and lower faces to compensate. That test gauge that I ground proved it's worth.

Quite fiddly getting the taper to seat with just a gnats c.... of clearance on the mounting flange and the correct depthing for the hydraulic O rings to seat was fun, but I got there in the end.

Where the O rings live in the base of the A2-6 taper the seating has been compromised by drilling the M10 tapped holes for the A2-5 chuck, so I will have to make up inserts otherwise the O rings will extrude under pressure.

The adaptor seems to seat nicely on the lathe spindle with just the right amount of 'pull in' on the flange to firmly seat the taper.

So outstanding are three things:

A/ Sort those O ring seats

B/ Turn the A2-5 taper in-situ on the lathe spindle

C/ Drill the dreaded oil way connecting holes  :bugeye:

Still I'm pleased with today's progress  :ddb:

« Last Edit: June 02, 2021, 04:22:35 PM by awemawson »
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex

Offline mattinker

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1071 on: June 02, 2021, 02:30:57 PM »
Ah but it worked Matthew :lol:
.

I never had any problems with solutions that work, I'm all for them!...................

Offline tom osselton

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1072 on: June 02, 2021, 04:42:52 PM »
Nice! I fitted a taper yesterday and overshot as well I think it’s close now I’ll see after the piece cools.

Offline russ57

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1073 on: June 02, 2021, 08:30:19 PM »
I guess it's becoming obvious to the audience why these aren't an off-the-shelf item...

-russ


Offline awemawson

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Re: The Sequel - Oh Blimey I bought a CNC Lathe (Beaver TC 20)
« Reply #1074 on: June 03, 2021, 02:20:56 AM »
A few hundred pounds will buy you an A2-6 to A2-5 converter off the shelf, but they don’t connect up the hydraulic oil ports and are too skinny to add them in later.Anyway they are provided hardened so drilling would be neigh on impossible even if there was enough meat in them.
Andrew Mawson
East Sussex